|
Register | Sign In |
|
QuickSearch
EvC Forum active members: 65 (9164 total) |
| |
ChatGPT | |
Total: 916,913 Year: 4,170/9,624 Month: 1,041/974 Week: 368/286 Day: 11/13 Hour: 1/1 |
Thread ▼ Details |
|
Thread Info
|
|
|
Author | Topic: Rebuttal To Creationists - "Since We Can't Directly Observe Evolution..." | |||||||||||||||||||||||
Kleinman Member (Idle past 365 days) Posts: 2142 From: United States Joined: |
Tanypteryx:Tany has learned all kinds of science chasing bugs around, but he can't explain how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail. But he does know that a germ cell line can get 200k retroviral infections that don't harm that cell line. That is Tany's science. Tany, tell us how that happens.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||
Kleinman Member (Idle past 365 days) Posts: 2142 From: United States Joined: |
vimesey:So, that's how the eye evolved, it was in plankton. Do you want to tell me how I evolved the ability to do photosynthesis?
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||
Kleinman Member (Idle past 365 days) Posts: 2142 From: United States Joined: |
Kleinman:They are your imaginary links, tell Google yourself.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||
Kleinman Member (Idle past 365 days) Posts: 2142 From: United States Joined: |
Kleinman:If they werem't imaginary links, you would post them. I'll show you again how to do it. For a single selection pressure: The basic science and mathematics of random mutation and natural selection And for multiple simultaneous selection pressures: The mathematics of random mutation and natural selection for multiple simultaneous selection pressures and the evolution of antimicrobial drug resistance It's that easy, instead of all your caterwauling.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||
Kleinman Member (Idle past 365 days) Posts: 2142 From: United States Joined: |
Kleinman:The fake cowboy thinks that caterwauling has to be a sound.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||
Kleinman Member (Idle past 365 days) Posts: 2142 From: United States Joined: |
vimesey:vimesey doesn't speak cowboy slang. And vimesey won't explain how I got the ability to do photosynthesis. I wonder if vimesey can do mathematics. Just what have you been smoking? All it does for you is make you caterwaul.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||
Kleinman Member (Idle past 365 days) Posts: 2142 From: United States Joined: |
Kleinman:Spoken like a true mathematical incompetent. Oh, pardon me, written like a true mathematical incompetent.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||
Kleinman Member (Idle past 365 days) Posts: 2142 From: United States Joined: |
vimesey:He sure does caterwaul a lot. Fun with Words – Cowboy Slang, Lingo, and Jargon - The Chief Storyteller Caterwauling: usually terrible singing, or complaining
Now tell me how I evolved the ability to do photosynthesis.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||
Kleinman Member (Idle past 365 days) Posts: 2142 From: United States Joined: |
Kleinman:Now that AZPaul3 has shown his mathematical competency, he will now explain how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail. I like your Wizard of Oz picture.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||
Kleinman Member (Idle past 365 days) Posts: 2142 From: United States Joined: |
Kleinman:What, no Wizard of Oz picture? Maybe this will do it. AZPaul3 will now give us a mathematical description of the Kishony and Lenski experiments. I prognosticate that it won't happen.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||
Kleinman Member (Idle past 365 days) Posts: 2142 From: United States Joined: |
Kleinman:It's easy to prognosticate that you don't understand why drug resistance evolves and how cancer treatments fail. And to ask you to do the mathematics of the Kishony and Lenski experiments is like asking a biologist to do the math. They can't do it either.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||
Kleinman Member (Idle past 365 days) Posts: 2142 From: United States Joined: |
I knew you had it in you.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||
Kleinman Member (Idle past 365 days) Posts: 2142 From: United States Joined: |
Kleinman:Watch the caterwauling fake cowboy post his fake links describing how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail. Message 2639 Kleinman:Now the caterwauling fake cowboy wants to be a caterwauling fake mathematician. Post some of your fake links that explain how drug resistance evolves and whay cancer treatments fail. And do it without making a sound.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||
Kleinman Member (Idle past 365 days) Posts: 2142 From: United States Joined: |
Kleinman:You finally learn some high school-level math (although very slowly) and you think you have proven UCD with a silly and mundane calculation. Kleinman:Why doesn't this hot physicist and mathematician point out to us all which variants are fixed in the Kishony experiment? You won't because you are wrong. That's why you can't do the physics or mathematics of either experiment. You don't even know what Kishony's bacteria are competing for. Kleinman:All the papers are based on a single selection pressure and a constant environment. You are so confused, you think the savannah is a single selection pressure constant environment. You are very confused and a slow learner. Kleinman:You are so slow. Do you want me to post the quote from the paper again where I don't make that assumption? It won't help you because you are so confused and you are an inattentive reader. Kleinman:Poor Taq, he is so confused. He doesn't understand that the way new alleles are generated is through descent with modification (mutations). Recombination can only shuffle existing alleles. Recombination won't accelerate the evolution of a beta-lactamase because all the mutations must occur in the same allele. Those five mutations take about (1/mutation rate) replications, and for E. coli, that's about 5 billion replications. And poor Taq thinks that it doesn't matter how many selection pressures exist in a population. No wonder he doesn't understand why 3 drug therapy works for the treatment of HIV and combination therapy works for the control of weeds and insects. In his confused world, there is only one selection pressure in a constant environment. Taq is so confused that he believes that reptiles evolve into birds and fish evolve into mammals but can't explain how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail. Taq should have studied more physics and mathematics than he did in his survey of physics course and survey of mathematics course. All it did was leave him very confused.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||
Kleinman Member (Idle past 365 days) Posts: 2142 From: United States Joined: |
MrIntelligentDesign:Thank you for your post. Let me make this clear. I do believe that evolution happens. In my medical practice, I have to deal with drug resistant infections which are caused by evolution. What I do think is that the idea of universal common descent is mathematically irrational nonsense and experiments and data shows that. What experiments and empirical data show is that adaptive evolution is much less likely to occur if the population has to evolve to multiple selection pressures simultaneously. This is due to the multiplication rule of probabilities, a subject that biologists like Taq and Tanypteryx have little or no training or experience. That's why they can't explain the evolution of drug resistance or why cancer treatments fail. The key to solving any probability problem is identifying the random trial (experiment). There are simple examples that help teach how to do that, such as tossing a coin, rolling dice, or drawing cards. For descent with modification, recognizing that one of the random trials is a replication and the possible outcomes are does a beneficial mutation occur or not. A mutation is also a random trial. A base substitution, deletion, insertion, or any other error can occur at that site. Then, it is a matter of applying the theorems and axioms of probability theory to derive the probability equations. The same kind of process can be used to derive the probability equation that governs recombination. You must then understand how to combine these equations with the deterministic components of evolution (for example, biological competition) to correctly model an evolutionary process. This is something that goes way over the heads of biologists. That's why they are still muddling around trying to model simple evolutionary examples such as the Kishony and Lenski experiments.
MrIntelligentDesign:Again, I am not trying to "uproot Evolution". Evolution does happen in biological populations. The Theory of Evolution has a major flaw, the concept of universal common descent. Descent with modification, recombination, and biological competition does happen. Still, the rate of adaptive evolution depends on many factors including population size, mutation rate, number of selection conditions, and carrying capacity of the environment... There is plenty of evidence of Intelligent Design that biologists ignore because of their bias. You only have to look at the microanatomy of a cell to see this. You have molecular pumps, valves, motors, chemical sequences to take energy molecules and break them down for fuel, etc. Michael Behe has pointed this out with his study of bacterial flagella. The problem is trying to formulate a mathematical explanation for this. Is it even a probability problem? What is the random trial? How do you mathematically model Creation? Evolution is an ongoing process that can be mathematically modeled and biologists like Taq and Tanpteryx are not trained as scientists and do a terrible job with their storytelling. That is why they are failures at describing the simplest examples of evolution. That is why the concept of universal common descent will go the way of phrenology from the field of biology. It just takes a little time for these zealots to learn the mathematical and physical facts of life.
|
|
|
Do Nothing Button
Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved
Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024