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Author
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Topic: Rebuttal To Creationists - "Since We Can't Directly Observe Evolution..."
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 103 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 839 of 2932 (900301)
10-26-2022 2:20 PM
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Reply to: Message 835 by AZPaul3
10-26-2022 12:43 PM
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Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
AZPaul3 writes: We're almost there.
So funny! Yet so sad. Pray tell ... how will you and your fellow-delusionoids know when you're finally "there"?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 835 by AZPaul3, posted 10-26-2022 12:43 PM | | AZPaul3 has not replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 103 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 843 of 2932 (900307)
10-26-2022 3:26 PM
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Reply to: Message 837 by Kleinman
10-26-2022 1:30 PM
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Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
That's an appropriate name for them ... the gatekeepers of the cult.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 837 by Kleinman, posted 10-26-2022 1:30 PM | | Kleinman has not replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 103 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 846 of 2932 (900312)
10-26-2022 3:32 PM
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Reply to: Message 842 by ringo
10-26-2022 3:25 PM
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Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
ringo writes: I know enough not to try to combine probabilities when the events are independent.
If you flip a coin three times, for example, each flip is an indepedent event. How would you calculate the probability of getting 3 heads from 3 flips?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 842 by ringo, posted 10-26-2022 3:25 PM | | ringo has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 850 by Taq, posted 10-26-2022 3:52 PM | | Dredge has not replied | | | Message 855 by ringo, posted 10-26-2022 4:20 PM | | Dredge has replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 103 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 847 of 2932 (900313)
10-26-2022 3:37 PM
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Reply to: Message 845 by ringo
10-26-2022 3:32 PM
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Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
ringo writes: Why would you multiply the probabilities? The draws are independent.
Wow. This is basic highschool maths ... and you haven't got a clue.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 845 by ringo, posted 10-26-2022 3:32 PM | | ringo has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 856 by ringo, posted 10-26-2022 4:22 PM | | Dredge has not replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 103 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 859 of 2932 (900334)
10-26-2022 5:58 PM
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Reply to: Message 855 by ringo
10-26-2022 4:20 PM
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Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
Hilarious. How can you criticise Kleinman when you don't even understand the basics of probability maths?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 855 by ringo, posted 10-26-2022 4:20 PM | | ringo has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 860 by Taq, posted 10-26-2022 6:05 PM | | Dredge has not replied | | | Message 869 by ringo, posted 10-26-2022 9:53 PM | | Dredge has replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 103 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 876 of 2932 (900360)
10-26-2022 11:41 PM
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Reply to: Message 868 by dwise1
10-26-2022 8:59 PM
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Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
dwise1 writes: Both Dredge and Kleinman have decided that the model for abiogenesis would be winning the lottery many times in a row.
I don't recall ever offering winning the lottery many times in a row as a model for abiogenesis. Please show me where I did that.
Since no creationist has ever answered the question of how they think evolution is supposed to work
I don't know anyone who knows what process produced the history of life on earth. Do you?
and hence they will also be deathly silent about abiogenesis
I don't know anyone who knows how life started. Do you?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 868 by dwise1, posted 10-26-2022 8:59 PM | | dwise1 has replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 103 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 877 of 2932 (900363)
10-27-2022 12:22 AM
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Reply to: Message 868 by dwise1
10-26-2022 8:59 PM
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Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
dwise1 writes: the math (maths to British types).
The word, "mathematics", is plural, so why do you Americanos call it "math", which is singular? Everytime you use "math", you should follow it with "( sic)". If "Sleepy Joe" Biden wants to be remembered as a great President who achieved great things, the first thing he should do is sign an Executive Order that declares the word "math" illegal, to be replaced by the word, "maths".
The entire point of this is what model we would use to calculate a probability for abiogenesis.
Your comment demonstrates how stupid and deluded abiogenesis researches are. Pray tell, O Wise One, how can anyone calculate a probability for abiogenesis when no one knows how it happened?
whereas Dredge is completely ignorant of both abiogenesis and of science
To be fair, for an idiot with a fragile, eggshell mind and an IQ of only 9, I think I'm doing OK.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 868 by dwise1, posted 10-26-2022 8:59 PM | | dwise1 has not replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 103 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 878 of 2932 (900364)
10-27-2022 12:29 AM
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Reply to: Message 868 by dwise1
10-26-2022 8:59 PM
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Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
dwise1 writes: I've been using joint probabilities for four decades ...
Have you worked out yet that the probability of finding a cetacean with a fused sacrum is zero(0)?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 868 by dwise1, posted 10-26-2022 8:59 PM | | dwise1 has not replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 103 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 879 of 2932 (900365)
10-27-2022 12:42 AM
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Reply to: Message 869 by ringo
10-26-2022 9:53 PM
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Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
ringo writes: you admit to being an idiot?
Join the club: Someone who doesn't even understand highschool maths but sees fit to criticise Kleinman's work qualifies as an idiot.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 869 by ringo, posted 10-26-2022 9:53 PM | | ringo has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 909 by ringo, posted 10-27-2022 11:47 AM | | Dredge has not replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 103 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 881 of 2932 (900373)
10-27-2022 8:19 AM
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Reply to: Message 844 by ringo
10-26-2022 3:29 PM
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Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
ringo writes: You forget what we're talking about here. Your claim is that abiogenesis is impossible. You calculate a very small probability and call that impossible. But three heads in a row id not impossible, so your example is worthless.
??? I have no idea what you talking about.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 844 by ringo, posted 10-26-2022 3:29 PM | | ringo has replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 103 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 883 of 2932 (900385)
10-27-2022 9:26 AM
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Reply to: Message 880 by dwise1
10-27-2022 2:47 AM
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Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
Dredge writes: I don't recall ever offering winning the lottery many times in a row as a model for abiogenesis. Please show me where I did that.
dwise1 writes: Your constant idiotic blather does make it difficult to figure out just what the hell you're talking about ... the question under discussion was your stupidly ignorant assertion violating even the laws of mathematics that the probability of abiogenesis was so low as to be less than zero. Then from there you immediately veered off to a scenario of winning the lottery several times in a row.
" immediately"? No
That was the only justification that you offered for your remark about the probability of abiogenesis, which is why any thinking person (which obviously excludes you) could only assume that that was your proposed model for abiogenesis probability.
"only justification"? No. "thinking person"? No. After giving your excuses fair and due consideration, I have reached the conclusion that they are devoid of merit. The discussion about the odds of winning the lottery originated in Message 580, which I mentioned in an example of "ringo logic", which in turn arose from an discussion about "statistical impossibility". In some fit of discombobulation, you somehow concluded that I was using the lottery example as a model for abiogenesis. Your error can only be attributed to a lack of intelligence. Sorry.
So then, if "winning the lottery many times in a row as a model for abiogenesis" is actually not your model, then just exactly what is your actual model?
You want me to provide a model for an event that no one understands and no one will never understand? Golly. All I know is, according to the mathematics of God, the probability of natural abiogenesis occurring is less than zero.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 880 by dwise1, posted 10-27-2022 2:47 AM | | dwise1 has not replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 886 by Phat, posted 10-27-2022 9:47 AM | | Dredge has not replied | | | Message 910 by ringo, posted 10-27-2022 11:50 AM | | Dredge has not replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 103 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 884 of 2932 (900387)
10-27-2022 9:38 AM
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Reply to: Message 880 by dwise1
10-27-2022 2:47 AM
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Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
Dredge writes: I don't know anyone who knows what process produced the history of life on earth. Do you?
dwise1 writes: Yes, of course! Evolution
No one knows how "Evolution" produced the changes evident in the history of life on earth. For example, you don't know what process resulted in cetaceans lacking the fused sacrum that was present in their alleged evolutionary ancestors.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 880 by dwise1, posted 10-27-2022 2:47 AM | | dwise1 has not replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 885 by Phat, posted 10-27-2022 9:41 AM | | Dredge has not replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 103 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 889 of 2932 (900394)
10-27-2022 9:53 AM
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Reply to: Message 880 by dwise1
10-27-2022 2:47 AM
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Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
[dwise1]Knowing how natural processes work, we can reconstruct an overall framework for something like abiogenesis[/qs]
" Dreamer, you know you are a dreamer
Well can you put your hands in your head, oh no!
I said dreamer, you're nothing but a dreamer ... Dreamer, you stupid little dreamer" From Dreamer, a song by Supertramp (1974)
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 880 by dwise1, posted 10-27-2022 2:47 AM | | dwise1 has not replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 103 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 892 of 2932 (900397)
10-27-2022 9:58 AM
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Reply to: Message 880 by dwise1
10-27-2022 2:47 AM
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Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
dwise1 writes: Knowing how natural processes work, we can reconstruct an overall framework for something like abiogenesis
" Dreamer, you know you are a dreamer
Well can you put your hands in your head, oh no!
I said dreamer, you're nothing but a dreamer ... Dreamer, you stupid little dreamer" From Dreamer, a song by Supertramp (1974)
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 880 by dwise1, posted 10-27-2022 2:47 AM | | dwise1 has not replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 893 by Phat, posted 10-27-2022 9:59 AM | | Dredge has replied |
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Dredge
Member (Idle past 103 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: 09-06-2016
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Message 941 of 2932 (900464)
10-27-2022 2:26 PM
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Reply to: Message 893 by Phat
10-27-2022 9:59 AM
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Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
Phat writes: I would caution you against referring to dwise1 as stupid, however. I respect his intelligence and his experience.
Yep ... dwise1 is an atheist, so he must be reeeal smart. "The fool says in his heart, 'There is no God.'" (Psalm 14:1) ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!!! Good one, Phat!
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 893 by Phat, posted 10-27-2022 9:59 AM | | Phat has seen this message but not replied |
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