Rebuttal To Creationists - "Since We Can't Directly Observe Evolution..."

xongsmith:

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My questions to you:

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When stupid asses like you can explain how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail, perhaps you will know something about biological evolution. Until then, answer your own stupid questions. You can't explain the simplest examples of biological evolution and it harms people. That's what we get with your stupidity.

xongsmith:

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that is direct observation of evolution in action.
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millions of genetic copying inexactly leads to a major variation in the population and those that the drug treatment fails to kill get live on to see another day-minute.
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obviously.

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It sure is direct observation and it takes a billion replications for each adaptive mutation in a single selection pressure environment. That is what you call a "major variation". Why doesn't Kishony's experiment work when he tried two drugs simultaneously? Why does three-drug therapy work for the treatment of HIV when the virus can rapidly evolve resistance to one drug in a week? Isn't it about time you learned something more about biological evolution than your sloppy "live on to see another day-minute" explanation? Or are you one of those biologists that got a social promotion in your survey of mathematics course?

Kleinman:

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it takes a billion replications for each adaptive mutation in a single selection pressure environment

xongsmith:

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did you know that there are more billions of lifeforms in your single body than there are people on the earth? so we got billions of replication attempts every minute already. and most are very hard to distinguish
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yes, i admit to not being a biologist.
but what are your credentials?
where are your published works?
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i think you are a Crackpot. You are sophmorically trying to be the Great Debunker and FAILING. You funny!

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Another amateur that only knows what some mathematically incompetent biologist tells him. And that biologist can't explain how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail.Here are a couple of publications that the amateur hasn't read.
For a single selection pressure:
The basic science and mathematics of random mutation and natural selection
And for multiple simultaneous selection pressures:
The mathematics of random mutation and natural selection for multiple simultaneous selection pressures and the evolution of antimicrobial drug resistance
You won't find any publications like these done by biologists. They weren't taught this kind of mathematics or physics in their survey of mathematics and survey of physics courses.So tell us, amateur, how do reptiles evolve into birds and fish evolve into mammals? Did the biologists that told you this also explain to you how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail? You bought their story hook, line, and sinker! You are a naive sucker.

Capt Stormfield:

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Hey, I read the first paper and the take away seems to be that it requires teams of scientists designing combination drug therapies to stop a virus from evolving.
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You may be missing the forest for the mathematical trees.

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Finding a target that will impair the reproduction of a virus without affecting the host is challenging but not as challenging as finding targets in a cancer cell that will not affect the host. But the mathematics is clear, it is much more difficult to adapt (evolve) to two or more simultaneous selection pressures than to a single selection pressure. It all has to do with more instances of the multiplication rule being applied to the population. That is the forest.

Kleinman:

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For a single selection pressure:
The basic science and mathematics of random mutation and natural selection
And for multiple simultaneous selection pressures:
The mathematics of random mutation and natural selection for multiple simultaneous selection pressures and the evolution of antimicrobial drug resistance

AZPaul3:

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CAUTION: The listed papers above are considered to be bogus, filled with incorrect math and inappropriate conclusions.
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The reader is advised to disregard their content as well as their author.

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AZPaul3 is trying out for the role of the monkey in the remake of the Scopes Monkey trial. His understanding of the physics and mathematics of biological evolution makes him a shoo-in.

AZPaul3:

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Note the respondent did not dispute the accuracy of the warning.

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How can I dispute AZPaul3. He knows much more about probability theory than the peer-reviewers and editors of Statistics in Medicine. And AZPaul3's explanation of biological evolution is crystal clear. In fact, it is invisible. He knows as much about how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail as do biologists. Nothing!

Phat:

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The problem is,(or seems to be) that you always insist on framing the argument.

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Yeah, right, like I did the Kishony and Lenski experiments. You've got a bunch of numbskulls claiming that reptiles evolved into birds and fish evolved into mammals millions of years ago and you have real, measurable, and repeatable experiments that demonstrate how evolution actually works. Choose your frame.

Kleinman:

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You've got a bunch of numbskulls claiming that reptiles evolved into birds and fish evolved into mammals millions of years ago....

ringo:

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The only numbskull saying that is you.

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ringo is a liar, a fake cowboy, and a fake mathematician who doesn't know how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail. Go Google that you dumbass fake. Is everyone in this bunch of numbskulls as dumb as ringo? The only thing real about ringo is he is a dummy. That's your cue to post about five messages that say nothing but fill space.

Kleinman:

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ringo is a liar...

ringo:

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Go ahead and point out anything I've said that isn't true.

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Oh right, reptiles don't evolve into birds and fish don't evolve into mammals. You must be one of those fake cowboys who tell tall tales. Tell us all about those fake transitions you have. And you still don't know how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail.

Kleinman:

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Oh right, reptiles don't evolve into birds and fish don't evolve into mammals. You must be one of those fake cowboys who tell tall tales. Tell us all about those fake transitions you have. And you still don't know how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail.

xongsmith:

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you can't find your way out of the bottle you are in,
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bye bye.

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This isn't going to be one of those long good byes, is it? And obviously, you aren't going to explain how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail, so I'll help you on your way out the door. For a single selection pressure:
The basic science and mathematics of random mutation and natural selection
And for multiple simultaneous selection pressures:
The mathematics of random mutation and natural selection for multiple simultaneous selection pressures and the evolution of antimicrobial drug resistance
That's your cue AZPaul3.

Kleinman:

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Oh right, reptiles don't evolve into birds and fish don't evolve into mammals.

ringo:

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Go ahead and point out anything I've said that isn't true.

ringo:

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That' is correct. They don't.
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Reptiles and birds evolved from a common ancestor. Fish and mammals evolved from a common ancestor.
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You and your cousin descended from a common ancestor. Your cousin did not descend from you.
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I have tried to explain it to you mathematically: B descended from A and C descended from A. That does NOT mean that C descended from B.
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But you don't understand the math.

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The fake cowboy and fake mathematician knows how evolution worked millions of years ago but can't explain how evolution works today. That includes explaining how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail. If you understand the math, explain it. But you don't, you are a fake.

Kleinman:

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The fake cowboy and fake mathematician...

ringo:

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I'm more of a mathematician than you. You don't understand that A → B and A → C are not the same as B → C.

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Yeah, right. Why don't you get your math published? You can't because you know less math than Tany and he didn't learn any math in his survey of mathematics course. And you can't explain how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail. You just have imaginary links from your Google search. Post them if you have them.

Kleinman:

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For a single selection pressure:
The basic science and mathematics of random mutation and natural selection
And for multiple simultaneous selection pressures:
The mathematics of random mutation and natural selection for multiple simultaneous selection pressures and the evolution of antimicrobial drug resistance

AZPaul3:

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CAUTION: The listed papers above are considered to be bogus, filled with incorrect math and inappropriate conclusions.
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The reader is advised to disregard their content as well as their author.

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Right on cue from the warmongering tool. So, when are you going to tar and feather me? I don't do house calls so you have to come here. I'll do something for you, I'll lance that big pimple that sits on top of your shoulders.

Kleinman:

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Why don't you get your math published?

ringo:

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Because it's something that is understood by every elementary school student. The only person I have ever encountered who doesn't understand it is you.

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Too bad you can't explain how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail.

Kleinman:

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Too bad you can't explain how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail.

ringo:

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As I said, you're not ready for that. You don't understand the very simplest basics of evolution, so how could you possibly understand how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail?
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Demostrate that you understand that A → B and A → C are not the same as B → C. Then we can move on.

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It doesn't matter whether I'm ready for that or not. It's the people suffering from drug-resistant infections and failed cancer treatments that need the correct explanation now. And they won't get that correct explanation from a fake cowboy and a fake mathematician.