Jar's belief statement- Part 2

Hey jar, sorry I missed the first part of your faith statement, and thank you for sharing, being honest, and exposing your beliefs. I have mixed feelings about your interpretation of who gets saved, or not, and I remain undecided on who will go to heaven or not. Most likely I will always be that way.I am still not ready to accept that everyone is going to heaven, as an absolute. The reason being, not only does the bible teach us that there are people who will go to hell, but my experiences in life lead me to question peoples hearts.The story of the warlord is cute, and it almost moved me, ( I sometimes wonder the same thing myself, and come to the same conclusion you have) but instantly gave me revelation. You see Jesus is the bread of life, he is the food. Jesus has provided food for everyone, so that they may be saved. All we have to do is eat of it.The warlord could very well have provided food for everyone, but he cannot force people to eat it. So there will be some that die by their own doing.I am pretty sure the only way into heaven is through Jesus. The question for me is, just what does that mean?

Yes.

I agree with that. I agree with that also. God will judged us based on what we know. This is where I don't agree. I am not saying I am right, or you are wrong, I am just not convinced that is the case.There could be a whole thread on that subject, but one thing that comes to mind is that I am not even convinced that there can be such a thing as an atheist. It is alos possible that God does indeed put His laws on our hearts and minds, and to deny them, is a knowing thing, judgable by the same standard for all. Yes, Jsesus is the bread of life for everyone. We all know God. Some just choose to deny it. What happens to them, is really not up to me. If I was in charge, I would have a hard time sending anyone to hell, but I am basing that on ignorance, and my own gullability. Maybe if I knew what God knew, I wouldn't be so forgiving? This is where I am still undecided, and praying for answers. But the answers may never be revealed to me, as I don't need to know. I don't think He creates damned people either. He creates us with a choice, a freedom of will, His laws in our hearts. We choose our destiny, not Him. He just gives us the chance to choose, and things to choose from.Which brings me back to the thought, just what is it to believe in Jesus? If it is possible that God's laws are really inside all of us, then we all know Him, whether we profess it with our mouths or not. I guess that is where the judging based on what we know comes into play.But I don't think there is a single person on this planet that can say who is going to hell or not.

I can accept all that as a possibility.

In some of our most desperate times of need, we will cry out to God. How's that saying go? There are no atheists in fox holes.Yes, we all have the capability to choose the best decision in each instance by turning to God for advice. But of course, that is not what actually happens. Studying it shows me just how life works, and how much deception there is. That is why I believe we will be judged based on what we know, which brings me to the next answer. Since we can't even acurately describe just what a Christian is, how can we say a Christian will be held to a higher standard? Many people claim they are Christian, yet don't even know the Holy Spirit, or even what it is. I met a guy last week, he had a big tattoo of Jesus's face, over a cross in the middle of his chest. I asked what that was all about, he said, and I quote, "I don't really know who Jesus is, but I believe in Him". He really didn't know much about the bible, or go to church, but talk about a leap of faith.What I saw was innocents, pure and simple, and I believe he will go to heaven in that innocents. It was like a child.jar condradicts himself in saying that Christians will be judged by a higher standard, on one hand, than claim "GOD will judge each of us from Her base of Perfect Knowledge,"There is one standard for all, which means we are judged each separately based on what we know. Simply saying your Christian or not, should not matter. It is immpossible to fathom how God will judge us.What is the difference between a teacher molesting a kid, or a preist? At first glance, you may say one or the other, but we don't know God's perfect knowledge base, or just what it was that drove either one to do what they did.

Depends also, maybe they won't eat of the food, simply because it comes from the warlord. I don't believe that either.

You believe all people are saved?

I am confused, what is so different about you thinking we don't start out damned?I don't think we start out damned either. I don't get that from reading the bible. I believe we are born into sin, but not damned.If children go to heaven, then we surely don't start out damned.

I think we are, but don't know the difference.

I don't see what you described as being any different as being born into sin.Of course we all have to learn right from wrong, but there is always what is in our hearts as well.We sin, and don't even know we sin, so to me, we don't have a choice and were born into it.Knowing this is why I think we will be judged based on what we know. Surely a just God would not damn you if you sinned, and really didn't know you were sinning. But we have no choice being born into it. It's up to us to figure it out.

What is so much tougher than being born a starving baby, or being born into a family of killers?It's all relative. A Christian who doesn't believe in God? Thats a new one. Please explain.As far as an atheist goes, I believe an atheist faces the same choice in life as a Christian. I don't even believe you could be atheist, but that's what they tell me.

I think your confusing sin with the american judicial system.
A sin, is always a sin in God's eyes. whether we get punished for it is another story.An person is born into this life with no choice but to experience sin. It is impossible to be sinless. And while an infant may not be capable of commiting sin the second it comes into the world, it will have no choice at some point but to experience sin. That's the way the world is, and that is what we are born into. This, IMO doesn't make you damned though. I have no clue how you can take that as a copout, or a nonsense statement. Examine your own heart, like I do mine. No matter what we know, or what we are taught, there are always choices to be made, right from wrong, good from bad, with God, without God. It's no different than what you are saying.In other words, we could be taught wrong. And live life thinking that what we are doing is right, when it is really wrong in God's eyes. At some point, you will find out that it is wrong. You may not agree with it, but if you seek the good, or seek God, then you will take the time to find out what is wrong or right, regardless of what you were taught. We do this because God made us this way, to seek Him, and to seek for His love. Can you show biblically about intent to sin?A sin is a sin, whether your guilty of it or not.
Just like taking someone's life, and how many ways you can be convicted of it, or even let go innocent. God will weigh the circumstances, and judge us fairly, this we agree on. You just don't think it's a sin, unless you know it's a sin.To me that is dangerous ground to be on, and a dangerous thing to be preaching. Sin is sin, no matter what. We are born into it. We just should not judge, or damn people for it, just like our Father forgives us.We all sin, but the good news is we are forgiven. If we are forgiven, then is it still sin? Of course it is.Genesis 4:7
If you do what is right, will you not be accepted? But if you do not do what is right, sin is crouching at your door; it desires to have you, but you must master it."Sin is in the world that we are born into. It exists on it's own, it's up to us to avoid it. If there wasn't a single human on earth, there would still be sin here.Matthew 13:41
The Son of Man will send out his angels, and they will weed out of his kingdom everything that causes sin and all who do evil.Everything that causes sin, not everyone. Because sin is here in the world with us.I guess a good question to ask you is, do you think it will be possible to sin in heaven?

Now that you know what sin is, is it possible to be sin free?

Then your the first to ever say that.But your basing it on intent to sin.Sin free by definition of what a sin is, not yours.Can you back up biblically what your saying about intent to sin?

I am not talking about infants. I believe all infants go to heaven just for that reason, the inability to discern right from wrong.Eventually you reach a point of awareness and you will know right from wrong even if no one teaches it to you. Like murder, I could be raised thinking murder was ok, but at some point I might realize that it is not.Once we reach this stage of awareness, it is impossible to be sin free. Hence we are born into a world of sin.And I see you cannot back it up biblically.It's funny you mention the children, because I think you once argued with me that the bible does not teach us that children go to heaven. That when Jesus said we are to be like children, he was not talking about children in the literal sense.