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Author Topic:   Choosing a faith
ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1507 of 3694 (903108)
12-04-2022 1:28 PM
Reply to: Message 1481 by Phat
12-01-2022 4:02 PM


Re: Why can't a Supreme Intelligence guide us towards ultimate purpose?
Phat writes:
I differ in some ways as believers, but I think we all agree that the supernatural cannot ever leave evidence...
"We" don't ALL believe that. Not by a long shot. It's obviously nonsense. Miracles, for example, leave evidence.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1481 by Phat, posted 12-01-2022 4:02 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1510 by Phat, posted 12-04-2022 1:40 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1509 of 3694 (903110)
12-04-2022 1:34 PM
Reply to: Message 1493 by Phat
12-02-2022 4:09 PM


Re: What does God want of Us
Phat writes:
There are numerous counterarguments...
No. There are not. All you believers ever do is re-state the "evidence that has already been refuted.
Phat writes:
... many people of both political persuasions are believers...
There are WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY more than two political persuasions.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1493 by Phat, posted 12-02-2022 4:09 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(1)
Message 1511 of 3694 (903113)
12-04-2022 1:50 PM
Reply to: Message 1508 by Phat
12-04-2022 1:33 PM


Re: The right Place and the right Time
Phat writes:
You once referred to Faith (our member) as a harpy.
I did. One of the definitions of harpy is "a shrewish woman" Merriam-Webster and shrewish means "ill-natured, intractable". That's Faith all over.
Phat writes:
I got it from you, however.
You have called Kamala Harris and Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez "harpies". I assumed you got the word from your usual ultra-right-wing sources.
And it's typical of you to use words without knowing what they mean.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1508 by Phat, posted 12-04-2022 1:33 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1512 of 3694 (903114)
12-04-2022 2:03 PM
Reply to: Message 1510 by Phat
12-04-2022 1:40 PM


Re: Why can't a Supreme Intelligence guide us towards ultimate purpose?
Phat writes:
There goes that Left authoritarianism again!
And there's another word you use without knowing the meaning.
Phat writes:
Not only have you used the word evidence as your holy mantra...
And now you're equating authoritarianism with holiness?
Phat writes:
... you have the audacity to proclaim what is and is not nonsense.
I gave an example illustrating that it is nonsense: Miracles leave evidence.
Phat writes:
Theo prefers the term word salad which jar used to use often.
At least salad is nutritious and can sometimes taste good if you have enough dressing. I prefer "nonsense" because it is neither nutritious nor tasty.
Phat writes:
Also...not all miracles leave evidence.
Then how do you know they happened?
And it doesn't matter anyway. You said that miracles CANNOT EVER leave evidence Message 1481. As long as ANY miracle leaves evidence, you are wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong and WRONG.
Phat writes:
You guys likely throw the reports out of any purported miracles that don't however...even if 1000 people saw it.
Hello? If 1,000 peple SAW it, that's eyewitness evidence. It's the worst possible evidence but it IS evidence.
Phat writes:
... liberal socialists becoming authoritarians because "they have to do it!"
Learn what "authoritarian" means.
If I feel that I have to do something, that is NOT authoritarian.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1510 by Phat, posted 12-04-2022 1:40 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1515 by Phat, posted 12-04-2022 3:12 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1520 of 3694 (903158)
12-05-2022 11:24 AM
Reply to: Message 1515 by Phat
12-04-2022 3:12 PM


Re: Why can't a Supreme Intelligence guide us towards ultimate purpose?
Phat writes:
Wiki defines it.
You should read that article and then apologize for calling me authoritarian. It in no way describes me.
Phat writes:
If you and the peanut gallery voted in a government...
I didn't. We have never had a federal government that I voted for.
Phat writes:
If you and the peanut gallery voted in a government that seized everyone's gold, as FDR did, that would be an authoritarian action.
"Authoritarian election" is an oxymoron.
And FDR did save America from the depression.
Phat writes:
China is run by Socialists. Note how they lock people down against their will "ostensibly" for the good of the people.
Most countries in the world did that. Even some states in your own backward nation did that. Governments can do things that aren't universally popular without being authoritarian.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1515 by Phat, posted 12-04-2022 3:12 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1521 by Phat, posted 12-06-2022 4:07 AM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1529 of 3694 (903214)
12-06-2022 11:36 AM
Reply to: Message 1521 by Phat
12-06-2022 4:07 AM


Re: Why can't a Supreme Intelligence guide us towards ultimate purpose?
Phat writes:
More precisely, (and according to Dalio's model) World War II rescued America from the Great Depression.
Funny you should say that. World War II ended the Depression because of enormous government expenditures.
And how is "rescued" more precise than "saved"?

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1521 by Phat, posted 12-06-2022 4:07 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1561 by Phat, posted 12-11-2022 3:41 PM ringo has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1530 of 3694 (903216)
12-06-2022 11:40 AM
Reply to: Message 1525 by Phat
12-06-2022 9:47 AM


Re: Doing My Homework
Phat writes:
Confirmation bias exists in atheists as well as believers.
Which is why everybody should be skeptical all the time. Don't trust your own instincts. See what other people think. If you can't reason out your own ideas, you may be wrong.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1525 by Phat, posted 12-06-2022 9:47 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1555 of 3694 (903483)
12-11-2022 1:35 PM
Reply to: Message 1551 by Phat
12-10-2022 12:59 PM


Re: What Is Worship?
Phat writes:
But if you are implying that God preferred one people over others, why is that a bad thing? I'm not Jewish, but I have no problem being a stepchild.
That's a false equivalence. God told his preferred people to massacre the "stepchildren".
Phat writes:
And what about Isaac and Ishmael?
In that case, Abraham chose his preferred son over his legitimate hier - and God told Abraham to kill his preferred son. What's your point?

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1551 by Phat, posted 12-10-2022 12:59 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1557 by Phat, posted 12-11-2022 2:28 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1558 of 3694 (903486)
12-11-2022 2:36 PM
Reply to: Message 1557 by Phat
12-11-2022 2:28 PM


Re: What Is Worship?
Phat writes:
If you are referencing the OT, keep in mind that there were no stepchildren at that point. The adoption papers were not signed until the crucifixion....
I am not keeping any of your made-up rubbish in mind.
Your idea of Christians being step-children doesn't work. It would require God to reject His Chosen People unless they too accepted the resurrection of Jesus. You're fantasizing a Father who adopts you and disowns His natural children.
Phat writes:
And how on earth was Ishmael the legitimate heir?
Duh! He was the oldest son.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1557 by Phat, posted 12-11-2022 2:28 PM Phat has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(2)
Message 1587 of 3694 (903760)
12-16-2022 11:11 AM
Reply to: Message 1581 by Phat
12-16-2022 8:01 AM


Re: Staying In Our Field
Phat writes:
... we need to nail down the definition of "expert" and apply that to the overall discussion regarding choosing a faith.

I can grant you the fact that an expert by definition is trained academically in the field of discipline related specifically to a category.
You answered your own question.
Phat writes:
Whom would you list as the best spokespersons for "atheists"...
Speaking for myself, I don't need a spokesperson.
Phat writes:
The closest I could come would be Matt Dillahunty....
One of our great Newfoundlander comedians, Mary Walsh, has a character named Marg Delahunty.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1581 by Phat, posted 12-16-2022 8:01 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1588 of 3694 (903761)
12-16-2022 11:16 AM
Reply to: Message 1583 by Phat
12-16-2022 9:05 AM


Re: An Interesting Rabbit Trail
Phat writes:
... you guys are convinced I am but a loon!
We're convinced you're a loon by what you write, not by the links you post.
Phat writes:
Believers would retort that *important information* is always recalled...
Nonsense, of course.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1583 by Phat, posted 12-16-2022 9:05 AM Phat has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(1)
Message 1631 of 3694 (904212)
12-23-2022 11:25 AM
Reply to: Message 1626 by Phat
12-23-2022 6:08 AM


Re: What does God want of Us
Phat writes:
But you are making secularism the default option. Which I suppose it is...for you. But what about us?
Default is default, period. When you buy Windows, you get default settings, period. Anything that fits your personal preferences is an option.
Phat writes:
My beef, however, is that if you had an experience, epiphany, intuition or inner unction one or more times that demonstratedly changed your life and worldview without being brainwashed by Religion...since you would have nevergiven religion that opportunity...then what?
Been there, done that, the T-shirt doesn't fit any more, answered your question more than once.
Grew out of it.
Phat writes:
Are we (secularist psychologists and critics) simply to lump you in as a mild delusional mental case?
Please do.
Phat writes:
I beg to differ
Beg all you want. You're still delusional.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1626 by Phat, posted 12-23-2022 6:08 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1665 of 3694 (904525)
12-31-2022 12:46 PM
Reply to: Message 1664 by Phat
12-31-2022 12:31 PM


Re: Phats two cents
Phat writes:
Why on earth (and perhaps in Heaven, far far away) would a person not be credulous?
For the same reason they would not be illiterate?

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1664 by Phat, posted 12-31-2022 12:31 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1674 by Phat, posted 12-31-2022 4:00 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1681 of 3694 (904589)
01-02-2023 11:01 AM
Reply to: Message 1674 by Phat
12-31-2022 4:00 PM


Re: Phats two cents
Phat writes:
So in your mind, being skeptical is better than being assured.
In every thinking mind.
You've been around EvC long enough to know that science is tentative.
You've been around Evc long enough to have heard that ignorance is often paired with arrogance.
Being "assured" is very bad.
Phat writes:
Neither is the spaghetti Monster, Bigfeet, Allah, or Stephen Hawking. This is a multiple choice test. Choose Wisely.
Untill you can SHOW us the difference, you are just blowing smoke.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1674 by Phat, posted 12-31-2022 4:00 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 442 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1682 of 3694 (904590)
01-02-2023 11:03 AM
Reply to: Message 1672 by Phat
12-31-2022 3:47 PM


Re: What does God want of Us
Phat writes:
if they don't stand for something(God) they will fall for anything.(gods) Thats my take, anyway.
Stop repeating that tripe. YOU are the one who falls for every YouTube video that comes along.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1672 by Phat, posted 12-31-2022 3:47 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
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