Choosing a faith

Absolutely, the church's tithes were not the only wrongs perpetrated. But that is not at issue. When the Irish were down they were kicked in the nuts. The issue I'm hearing is the church had a major part in that kick and reaped the benefits along with all the other royally jackbooted factions. How much or how little is not a question. The church did it, no doubt lobbied for it, with the connivance of the crown. That is the indictment.

I haven't seen that as a major historical item. If some crazy historians think like that then it's ... crazy.No one should be excusing the crown from slave labor terrors in India regardless of the Brits motives. I don't see motivation as the issue. The crown's acts stand on their own merits and evil resulted.Why excuse the church of perpetrating a similar evil in Ireland? Does the body count matter?

It's religion. No matter what the flavor they are all cults by definition. And like the coach of a football team the priest leads in the "we're number one!" chant as their worship service. All cults are the same. Stupid mob mentality.

GDR, please, a little respect. This is BS. They went away? Why? What compelled them? They really didn't have a choice did they. They didn't have any choice to be in attendance at all.Something made them move off to the lake of fire where, apparently, according to your Narnia fairytales, they roast marshmallows and BBQ ribs while being given a chance to "turn it around."You just refuse to recognize the evil.

What? Of course it is consistent with natural selection. How could it not be? Do you understand fitness and natural selection? How could altruism NOT benefit a social species like H. sapiens?

Do you really have to ask this? Don't the young women benefit from education and increased political awareness? Over the long term could not their increased stature in society help their offspring survive with better living conditions than dirt poor? No. Thinking through a problem in all its effects is the only requirement.

Mocking theists should be a constant in-your-face confrontation by any sane person. You guys peddle bullshit.Though you personally do not ascribe to all the feces pieces you are a product of that mentality; that religious mentality that has tortured humanity for millennia. You and your fellow religionists should be opposed, mocked, ridiculed until your creeds vanish from the world.Your "love for all" plank is nice and all but you arrive at it by a twisted mental exercise that ignores reality putting your personal religious fantasy in its place. The same twisted ignoring of reality that religions forced upon humanity from the start. The result being a barbaric bloody history of evil perpetrated on the people by the priests and their faithful.It needs to end. Religion must die.

If your point is that religionists, expressing their views, find EvC a difficult neighborhood then your point is granted. And, yes, try as I may, things can get caustic.Point of emphasis is that the hard feelings are not so much at you, you really are a pleasant personality ... for a religious nutjob, but at your creed, and more in my case, wtf kind of mind twists lead to such ... stuff.Don't feel bad. I find pleasure in this thread because of your presence even though, at times, I want to smack some sense into you with a 2x4. I hope you feel the same. Some of that love presence would be good right now, yes? [abe]An additional point of emphasis just for full disclosure. Whenever someone skewers your … stuff … I’m going to give them a kiss.

It's not a bug but a feature. A bit of spice in the dull roll of repetition.

Phat, the discussion is about someone "choosing" hell over heaven.For some reason ringo thinks the very idea is idiotic.GDR is trying to convince him the lake of fire is a camp ground where a lot of bbq and chili-fests go on until an atheist sequestered there realizes their mistake. Then they get to bask in the glory of god.GDR has a book about Camp Lake O' Fire and its amenities but ringo's not about to waste his time on something he thinks is so obviously idiotic.Or something like that.BTW, ringo is right.

It was a poke in the ribs. I'm disappointed you didn't mention the Camp Lake O' Fire and the amenities. I spend a lot of creative capital on these things.No concerns. Anyone following this thread knows that is not what you actually said; that it was a humous little vignette penned by an addled old man.

It's called acculturation. You know that.

No, you can't trust your own intuition. None of us can. That is why we seek confirmation through others on everything, even our stupidities. And the ever changing data is a good thing. That means we are ever refining our understanding.We don't do random calculations. That's a Kleinmen thing. Science insists on especially rigorous treatment and testing of our models to ensure they conform to reality.And that means you can not defend the idea that your belief can and should stand side-by-side with secular humanist rationality. More, such shows why you provide no competition to secular humanist rationality.

Since reality is defined by evidence and human evidence is the only kind there is I'd say that is a safe assumption.

So pray tell what miracles have happened that left no evidence of their happening and how do you know? You mean like the mass hysteria that brought on Our Lady of Fátima - Wikipedia and its Miracle of the Sun - Wikipedia? The same kind of hysteria humans are well known for after football games?