God is evil if He has miracles and does not use them.

A world where a god decides to whatever and everything it feels is right is a world where someone else calls the shots; where someone else's morality wins the day. It is a world without free human will. It's a dictatorship on a Universal scale.And it's only minorly tolerable if the god in question is decent and we agree with its morality. If the god in question ends up being the god of fundamentalist Christianity, or Allah, or even worse, then imagine the horror we would be living in.I don't want a world where some all-powerful being goes around doing what it thinks is right simply because it has the power to do so.The thought is frightening. At least for me.Jar probably has his own reasons And I know you asked him, but I thought I'd chime in.

If your god exists, Faiththe god who doesn't believe in equal rights for homosexuals, who damns people to Hell for doing science, who's gonna send his hybrid son to war with everyone who disagrees with himthen we are first all in trouble and second should be preparing to fight that god with every power we have.If a truly good god exists, then that is great. If no god exists, so it is. But if some wicked, hateful, god such as the one preached by fundamentalist Christians exists, then we have a real duty to one another to do whatever it takes to put him out of power and then laugh at how pathetic he is.It's pretty straightforward, Faith.

We don't know what might go down if my daughter is raped or not raped until it happens.This is a human problem and it is up to humans to handle it. I can tell you I feel grateful when I believe GOD has acted on my behalf to help me when I have felt I needed it, but that is because I am selfish like anyone else.So, overall, it is probably better for any god to simply stay out of it and let our destinies play out as we make them play out. Sure. It is always possible that allowing the rape makes possible a better world than stopping the rape. But we don't know that. It's not about being corrupted. It is about taking away the free will of humanity. Maybe. Maybe not. But it is for us to decide, not some supra-human dictatorno matter how benevolent he/she may be.I don't want your god deciding my fate. And I am sure no one wants my god deciding their fate. So it's probably fair if we all agree that no god should be deciding anyone's fate.Edited by Jon, : No reason given.

Your god is evil and I would fight him till one of our deaths.

Who's affected? It's a human problem. No god has a right to interfere. But that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying it's no god's problem and so no god's business. What choice? I don't know. I'm not her. I don't know what you're asking. I think I've been pretty clear regarding my position on this.What more do you want?

Okay. Animals might help me make my point, though I really doubt anything such as 'evil' exists for animals, and if it does it is certainly nothing like how we perceive right and wrong. But consider someone who 'rescues' the slow deer from the wolf by scaring off the latter.Are those actions moral? Is that the 'right' thing to do? Is it good to save one and starve the other?The answer is that there's no clear way to categorize such things into right and wrong groups. It's a situation in which we really have no business getting involved. The deer is probably happy, but the wolf isn't; the two have competing interests and goals that both make the other worse off.Sometimes we can feel more justified in our approach to such things, like if we save a bird from our cat. But that is just us feeling better about it. It doesn't really change the fact that it is none of our business to get involved and that getting involved, however benevolent it may be, robs the actors of their freedom. It is a human problem not because only humans can perceive right/wrong. It is a human problem because it affects humans.I don't know why you think it is okay for another agent to remove the power from humans to decide their own destinies. I don't think it is okay, no matter how smart or well-intended that other agent may be. Your contention is that a dictatorship is a good thing so long as the dictator does what we want him to do.My contention is that a dictatorship is not a good thing, no matter how good the dictator may be.

I'm not interested in endless lists of analogies. So I will reply only to the stuff we've already brought up: Nonsense: evil. I care more about my cat than I do about the bird. I would still save the bird. Why do you think that is? Well if your opinions extend only to the realm of a single hypothetical situation, then I suppose the whole thing's moot.Jon

Nonsense.You're just trying to pass responsibility off onto someone else when it is us who should be taking care of our business and not some dictator god.

You're in the wrong thread and way out of your depth.

No it doesn't. It was conceived of by humans, written by humans, is read by humans, and understood by humans.It has nothing to do with animals or any intelligence other than humans. Yep. For my own selfish interests; because of what I want. Yes, me too. A god that gets involved in things that aren't his business is doing so out of his own selfish interests. He should grant people whatever they want and keep them from what they don't want? Are we talking about gods or puppets? By moot I mean There is no point bringing up examples, analogies, or hypotheticals if their explanatory power extends no further than their own sphere of fantasy.

quote:

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Wikipedia on the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil:

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In Western Christian art, the fruit of the tree is commonly depicted as the apple, which originated in central Asia. This depiction may have originated as a Latin pun: by eating the malum (apple), Eve contracted mālum (evil). It is also possible that this depiction originated simply because of the religious painters' artistic licence.

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Unless it is.But in my opinion, the whole idea of what is and is not possible for a god to do misses the point that no god really has any business in deciding the fates of creatures that are supposed to be autonomous and free.It is the god who does get involved at his own whim and to suit his own feelings of right/wrong and impose them on others that is evil, not the god who keeps his nose out of where it does not belong.Edited by Jon, : No reason given.

What book?

What you've described is criminals going to prison, speeders paying their tickets, children going to school, and kids eating their vegetables.

Seems to me you're just talking about moving goal posts.