I want to be convinced - an experiment

Hi there.I don't know where to start to answer this, but there have been other people with your dilemma. You may want to read the website noted below. I too was brought up as a child being taught religion as "fact". It was only over time and having learned more about the world ( travel, geology, botany, zoology etc ) that I gradually moved away from belief in a supernatural being.http://www.geocities.com/paulntobin/index.html

OOpsJust noticed that the site I posted is one you originally referred to. Anyway if you would like me to tell you why I as a geologist do not believe in any god, I can explain it to you.

SardeCongrats on your belief in a supernatural being.Much of the early work in geology was done by theologists who studied fossils etc believing they were part of god's creation.For example, William Buckland (1784-1856) was a fellow of Corpus Christi College, Oxford (1808-1825) and one of the foremost geologists of his day. Professor of Mineralogy at Oxford from 1813, he was made Reader in Geology in 1819. He was President of the Geological Society twice, in 1824 and 1840. In 1845 he became Dean of Westminster.They tried to understand fossils in this light. But as time went on and fossils were better understood, it became apparent that their existence and distribution conflicted with a literal interpretation of the bible's creation story. Geology also disproves the flood story.So I, like others, have had to compare what I see with my own eyes with biblical accounts. Being a geologist allows me to do this at least in the field of geology.If you want to believe in god as a matter of faith, that is fine. But trying to reconcile your faith with the natural world of science is difficult. If you believe in a literal interpretation of the bible and evolution as supported by the fossil record, then there is already a conflict.I would have thought you would have looked at evidence both for and against god before you made your decision.

PhatboyAre you saying that it would be impossible to have a mum with atheist beliefs who raises her kids on love and discipline and who is able to show her kids an inner character that is humble, loving, fair, and humerous?

You are missing the point about science. Science is testable and repeatable. You do not simply have to learn about it from a textbook.For example, if you do not believe in the increasing complexity of flora and fauna with time as indicated by the fossil record, you can check it yourself. All you need is a rock exposure and a hammer.

I have looked up several definitions of love, one is reproduced below."A strong affection for another arising out of kinship or personal ties. Maternal love for a child. "There is no mention of god in this.So you are saying there is atheistic love and another kind of love you imply is god's genuine love?Hmmmmm.....interesting concept.So only the love associated with your particular supernatural being is the genuine one ? Is that the case?

Hmmmmmm another interesting concept. You will note that in this forum, it is unusual to argue starting with the assumption that god exists and that the bible is the inerrant word of god.I,and many others, do not accept that the bible was written or inspired by god. So when you quote the bible to me, it has no special meaning. You may as well quote from " The Washington Post ".When referring to the word love, I was referring to the English definition, which is what we are communicating in. I thank you for the history lesson about Greek and Roman gods, but in terms of present day interpretations of love, do you still contend that a mother with atheist beliefs cannot have genuine love for her child ?If certain things were "unchallengable" as you wrote, there would be no need for debating forums such as this one. The very existence of god is challengable.This may be a wild guess, but of all the hundreds of religions and denominations that exist around the world, do you assert that it is only the supernatural being that you believe in who can dish out genuine love ?

I lustfully submit that you know very little about science. If you want to know what science is, you should read up on it. Otherwise discussing it with you is futile.Yes scientists believe what they see and test and retest to prove or
DISPROVE their theory.Do you see a problem with this approach?Eyewitness acccounts of course can be challenged. How do you deal with the eyewitness acccounts of people who claim to have seen and been abducted by aliens? So you would argue that their accounts cannot be denied? Yes ?In the case of the bible's so called eyewitness accounts, the people who did so are dead and cannot be questioned about what they saw. Even in the case of eyewitness accounts in today's courts, witnesses are not considered very reliable.Do you have 100% proof that the eyewitness accounts in the bible are correct? If so how do you know? Please don't quote the bible, that would be circular reasoning.