Examples of non-Christian Moral systems.

What a crock. Unless this is used to argue that even North American indigens engaged in moral relativism since many tribes actually encouraged killing, stealing, rape, and adultery - as long as it was perpetrated on another tribe.

Ultimately, people have been left to their own devices, independent of one god, and yet they continue to create codes of conduct (and morality) which are often very similar to the codes and morals of other societies to which they have never been exposed. Why is that?Humans are by nature social animals; so we are very rarely left to our own, individual devices. Since what we do can impact the others with whom we live and work, our societies form codes and rules for what types of behaviors are acceptable regardless of the deity that society professes to worship.Even prison populations, and if ever there were a godless society there you have it, develop codes of behavior to which its members are expected to adhere or face the consequences.The point is, we cannot live in a state of anarchy and live in a society simulataneously. Therefore codes of conduct are developed. Most of these codes are in the self-interest of the individual, so it is not surprising that we see ideas such as 'do not murder,' and 'do not steal' as archetypal across cultures.Add to this the concept that those who do not adhere to the codes of society are 'bad' members of society, while those who do are 'good;' and of a sudden you have morality attached to what was originally common sense and self-preservation.

Yes. No. And I didn't mean to imply otherwise. In fact, the opposite was my intention.

Are you counting Turkey, China, Vietnam, India, Pakistan, Iran, Iraq, Myanmar, Japan, Egypt, and Syria as Judaic nations?

What? I challenge that. The mongols, huns, goths, celts, Persians, Indian Aryans... there are plenty of examples of cultures and religions which were just as intolerant, or moreso, than Judaic based religions.Lots of countries have liquidated entire populations. That's about as intolerant as it gets.This message has been edited by custard, 06-30-2004 12:45 PM

Interesting. I never really thought about that before.

Another question Jar,Would you consider the USSR a Judaic state?

1-Even though it was an athiest state? I don't understand. Do you mean that states that were once non-Judaic can't become Judaic and vice-versa?

That was my point. USSR, an athiest state, perpetrated some of the most heinous acts of murder and genocide in the 20th century.I was using that as an example to your challenge to come up with any non-Judaic states that began, were responsible for war and/or aggression over the last 2000 years.You responded that Russia was a Judaic state, so I was confused.

They killed Jesus, make matzoh with the blood of Christian children, and run the international jewish conspiracy which, with the masons, templars, the illuminati, and the Carlysle Group, are responsible for roughly 97% of the word's tragedies - including AIDS (wait that was Ronald Reagan).Seriously though, ask the Palestinians or the British who tried to govern Palestine until the Jewish and Arab terrorists made them bail altogether.If you believe in the bible, the Jews killed all sorts of peoples. Look what they did to the poor Midianites.

1- What the hell are you talking about?2-Have you even read this thread?3-Are you saying Pol Pott had no responsibility for the deaths of nearly 3 million people?This message has been edited by custard, 07-01-2004 07:33 AM

1- I'm not surprised you have uncovered yet another conspiracy. I understand why you hate the US, I would too if I weren't a citizen of the greatest free republic on the face of the earth; so I certainly don't blame your envy.2- This has nothing to do with what Jar and I were talking about. We were discussing war and aggression by Judaic and non-Judaic states. Jar wrote this: I gave him several examples including the Soviet Union as examples of non-Judaic nations that created conflict. Your comment was a non-sequiter.

The Romans crucified him. If it weren't for Judas and the Pharisees who turned him in, he wouldn't have been crucified, right or wrong?And (for bonus points) the Pharisees were:A- Jews
B- Democrats
C- Other
D- I prefer not to enroll

I know you envy our dental care.

The USSR was not responsible for Red October? It wasn't responsible for Stalin and the gulags? The USSR didn't crush rebellions in Hungary and the Czech/Slovakia republics? The USSR didn't invade Afghanistan? Are you freaking serious?Where does the fault for those events lie? With the CIA plant?This message has been edited by custard, 07-01-2004 08:18 AM