|
Author
|
Topic: The TRVE history of the Flood...
|
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2402 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: 01-12-2008
(1)
| |
| |
| |
|
Message 832 of 1352 (808367)
05-10-2017 11:30 AM
|
|
|
Davidjay: "Notice how I always answer queries"
I posted this to Davidjay a couple of times (see Message 3) and prodded him for an answer a dozen times. He has never come up with a meaningful reply.
Coyote writes: My own archaeological research disproves the global flood ca. 4500 years ago. Research by my colleagues disproves it thousands of times over. In my research I have continuity of human cultures from before to after the date of the flood, and most importantly I have mitochondrial DNA of the same type extending from before to after that date. If there was such a flood, the earlier mtDNA haplotype would be eliminated, to be replaced by a type from the Middle East. A few other little details: there is no evidence of the erosional or depositional features that would necessarily associate with such a flood in the area I study. But if you truly want to see the features left by flood erosion, google "channeled scablands" and look at the images. Some notable examples are from central and eastern Washington: The nice thing about the flood evidence in Washington is that we can date the events and we know the cause! They occurred between 18,000 and 13,000 years ago, and resulted from formation and breakage of ice dams upstream. Oh, and this evidence is about three or four times older than the purported global flood. How is it that we see the evidence of those older floods but not evidence of a much larger and much more recent flood? (Answer: it didn't happen.) So, don't be claiming that the flood is TRVE history. It is a belief, not a fact. So, Davidjay, here's your big chance to "prove" the global flood ca. 4500 years ago. But you should be aware that all the mathematical models you can concoct won't overturn the huge amounts of real-world evidence that shows there was no such flood. Maybe you could also address my archaeological research, cited above--which you ignored on the previous thread? Your continual avoidance of this evidence shows that your claim, "Notice how I always answer queries" is as bogus as the rest of your posts.
Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
|
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2402 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: 01-12-2008
|
|
|
Message 864 of 1352 (808506)
05-11-2017 9:45 AM
|
Reply to: Message 863 by CRR
05-11-2017 7:06 AM
|
|
Transitional fossils
Transitional fossils are still missing. Why do you keep repeating this false creationist talking point? It is false, and repetition won't make it true no matter how many times it is repeated. Here are some links, each of which contains many transitional fossils: Access denied | National Center for Science Education List of transitional fossils - Wikipedia CC200: Transitional fossils
Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 863 by CRR, posted 05-11-2017 7:06 AM | | CRR has not replied |
|
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2402 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: 01-12-2008
|
|
|
Message 892 of 1352 (809091)
05-16-2017 10:14 AM
|
|
|
Is Davidjay lying or will he finally answer?
In Message 5 Davidjay claims:
quote:
I always engage in discussions and always prove my points. But evolutionists want me to agree with their false science and false givens. ... In an open debate, BOTH sides are required to answer questions...
This is good to know, because then Davidjay will obviously answer the question I have been prodding him with for a month or so. As posted in Message 3 of this thread (and in a previous thread): Coyote writes: My own archaeological research disproves the global flood ca. 4500 years ago. Research by my colleagues disproves it thousands of times over.
In my research I have continuity of human cultures from before to after the date of the flood, and most importantly I have mitochondrial DNA of the same type extending from before to after that date. If there was such a flood, the earlier mtDNA haplotype would be eliminated, to be replaced by a type from the Middle East. A few other little details: there is no evidence of the erosional or depositional features that would necessarily associate with such a flood in the area I study. But if you truly want to see the features left by flood erosion, google "channeled scablands" and look at the images. Some notable examples are from central and eastern Washington: The nice thing about the flood evidence in Washington is that we can date the events and we know the cause! They occurred between 18,000 and 13,000 years ago, and resulted from formation and breakage of ice dams upstream. Oh, and this evidence is about three or four times older than the purported global flood. How is it that we see the evidence of those older floods but not evidence of a much larger and much more recent flood? (Answer: it didn't happen.) So, don't be claiming that the flood is TRVE history. It is a belief, not a fact.
Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
|
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2402 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: 01-12-2008
|
|
|
Message 894 of 1352 (809102)
05-16-2017 10:38 AM
|
Reply to: Message 893 by Davidjay
05-16-2017 10:36 AM
|
|
Re: I always answer, 'Just ask Jesus'
Word salad doesn't answer my very specific questions. You have been ducking, dodging, and weaving to avoid answering these questions for a month. Face it, you have no answers to these questions, and can't counter the evidence--and that's clear to everyone.
Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 893 by Davidjay, posted 05-16-2017 10:36 AM | | Davidjay has not replied |
|
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2402 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: 01-12-2008
|
|
|
Message 897 of 1352 (809148)
05-16-2017 12:21 PM
|
Reply to: Message 896 by Davidjay
05-16-2017 12:18 PM
|
|
Re: I always answer, 'Just ask Jesus'
You are still trying to avoid responding to the evidence I posted disproving the flood (see Message 892, above). You have no answers, eh?
Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 896 by Davidjay, posted 05-16-2017 12:18 PM | | Davidjay has not replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 898 by edge, posted 05-16-2017 1:37 PM | | Coyote has seen this message but not replied |
|
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2402 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: 01-12-2008
|
|
|
Message 915 of 1352 (809680)
05-20-2017 10:16 AM
|
Reply to: Message 914 by Davidjay
05-20-2017 10:07 AM
|
|
Ducking, dodging and weaving (same as always)
Eolutionists have no arrows in their quills, and no connected neurons in their brains and no experiences in thier histories, and dont ask the God of wisdom for WISDOM and KNOWLEDGE.... and so can only post one line denials. And you have still not addressed the evidence I posted to you over a month ago from my own archaeological research, even though I've prodded you a dozen times or more. The reason: you have no answers to that evidence. Only bluster, bombast, bragging and bullshit.
Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 914 by Davidjay, posted 05-20-2017 10:07 AM | | Davidjay has not replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 917 by edge, posted 05-20-2017 10:51 AM | | Coyote has seen this message but not replied |
|
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2402 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: 01-12-2008
|
|
|
Message 957 of 1352 (811504)
06-08-2017 9:52 PM
|
|
|
More evidence
Evidence for a Flood:Sediment layers suggest that 7,500 years ago Mediterranean water roared into the Black Sea Evidence for a Flood | Science|
Smithsonian Magazine ... It was this event that Pitman and Ryan believe could be the flood recorded in the Book of Genesis. The salt water poured through the deepening channel, creating a waterfall 200 times the volume of Niagara Falls (anyone who has ever traveled to the base of the falls on the Maid of the Mist will have a sense of the power involved). In a single day enough water came through the channel to cover Manhattan to a depth at least two times the height of the World Trade Center, and the roar of the cascading water would have been audible at least 100 miles away. Anyone living in the fertile farmlands on the northern rim of the sea would have had the harrowing experience of seeing the boundary of the ocean move inland at the rate of a mile a day. More
Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 958 by Faith, posted 06-08-2017 10:25 PM | | Coyote has replied |
|
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2402 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: 01-12-2008
|
|
|
Message 959 of 1352 (811510)
06-08-2017 10:31 PM
|
Reply to: Message 958 by Faith
06-08-2017 10:25 PM
|
|
Re: More evidence
No local flood will do it, Coyote, no matter how scary for the locals. As Prof. Tolkien noted, "The tale grew in the telling." From 5600 BC until it was written down in various accounts provides lots of time for the tale to grow.
The Bible is clear that the Flood covered the whole earth. The bible is wrong.
Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 958 by Faith, posted 06-08-2017 10:25 PM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 960 by Faith, posted 06-08-2017 11:05 PM | | Coyote has replied |
|
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2402 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: 01-12-2008
|
(2)
| |
| |
| |
|
|
Message 961 of 1352 (811520)
06-09-2017 12:08 AM
|
Reply to: Message 960 by Faith
06-08-2017 11:05 PM
|
|
Re: More evidence
There's no point in proposing a local flood, we aren't buying it. That's the difference: science goes where the evidence is.
Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 960 by Faith, posted 06-08-2017 11:05 PM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 962 by Faith, posted 06-09-2017 12:41 AM | | Coyote has replied |
|
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2402 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: 01-12-2008
|
(1)
| |
| |
| |
|
|
Message 966 of 1352 (811566)
06-09-2017 9:58 AM
|
Reply to: Message 962 by Faith
06-09-2017 12:41 AM
|
|
Re: More evidence
When it comes to the historical sciences there is no way to verify your conclusions anyway. It's not really science. REAL science makes REAL use of REAL evidence, and that can't be said for the sciences that interpret the past. Any field that follows the scientific method is a real science whether it contradicts the bible or not. Creationists are trying to destroy the reputation of "historical sciences" because of their religious beliefs, not because of some actual faults in those sciences. Given that, its no wonder we accuse creationists of being anti-science.
Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 962 by Faith, posted 06-09-2017 12:41 AM | | Faith has not replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 967 by jar, posted 06-09-2017 10:17 AM | | Coyote has seen this message but not replied |
|
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2402 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: 01-12-2008
|
|
|
Message 987 of 1352 (811970)
06-13-2017 8:38 PM
|
Reply to: Message 986 by Faith
06-13-2017 8:18 PM
|
|
Re: I've proved it a million times already
How could an argument about the strata or biological facts be from faith? The same way you hand-wave away all of the evidence on dating: If it disproves your beliefs you don't accept it.
Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 986 by Faith, posted 06-13-2017 8:18 PM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 988 by Faith, posted 06-13-2017 8:58 PM | | Coyote has replied |
|
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2402 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: 01-12-2008
|
(2)
| |
| |
| |
|
|
Message 989 of 1352 (811978)
06-13-2017 9:05 PM
|
Reply to: Message 988 by Faith
06-13-2017 8:58 PM
|
|
Re: I've proved it a million times already
I've never "hand-waved" away your dating stuff. I've said I can't answer it and I have better evidence anyway which makes the dating false. That is NOT "hand-waving." To me it is. You reject the dating evidence for reasons of faith and belief, so you just ignore all the evidence RAZD and I have posted. That's hand-waving it all away, not refuting it or researching it or anything else.
Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 988 by Faith, posted 06-13-2017 8:58 PM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 990 by Faith, posted 06-13-2017 9:08 PM | | Coyote has replied |
|
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2402 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: 01-12-2008
|
|
|
Message 991 of 1352 (811983)
06-13-2017 9:16 PM
|
Reply to: Message 990 by Faith
06-13-2017 9:08 PM
|
|
Re: I've proved it a million times already
I reject it for better evidence, that is not the same thing. Just don't count on career in science!
Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 990 by Faith, posted 06-13-2017 9:08 PM | | Faith has not replied |
|
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2402 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: 01-12-2008
|
|
|
Message 1007 of 1352 (812037)
06-14-2017 12:19 PM
|
Reply to: Message 1004 by Faith
06-14-2017 11:15 AM
|
|
Re: I've proved it a million times already
The "working hypothesis" is known as Uniformitarianism and since we know things were very very different before the Flood, immensely more favorable to growing things, we ain't buying it. The "flood" is an unevidence assumption (belief), and can't be used in a rational argument. Particularly when we have evidence from before, during, and after that time period that conclusively disproves any such flood. You seem to be confusing belief with evidence.
Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 1004 by Faith, posted 06-14-2017 11:15 AM | | Faith has not replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 1030 by ICANT, posted 06-15-2017 1:33 PM | | Coyote has replied |
|
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2402 days) Posts: 6117 Joined: 01-12-2008
|
|
|
Message 1011 of 1352 (812062)
06-14-2017 2:54 PM
|
Reply to: Message 1010 by Taq
06-14-2017 2:47 PM
|
|
Re: I've proved it a million times already
We can see the past, and archaeologists do it every day. So do a lot of other -ologists.
Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge. Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1 "Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity. Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 1010 by Taq, posted 06-14-2017 2:47 PM | | Taq has not replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 1012 by Faith, posted 06-14-2017 3:03 PM | | Coyote has replied |
|
™ Version 4.2