Is the bible authoritive and truly inspired?

read FF Bruce's The New Testament Documents: Are They reliable?

judging and condemning something that has not been answered yet. we all know the three ancient languages originallyused to pen the Biblical books, and we know that nothing is too hard for God thus putting His original words into english or any language to preserve them is not that difficult for Him especially when He wants all men to be saved.

No you're not. You're making stuff up. Actually, it's you who know nothing of it, I've been in "the know" since my birth, having a close relationship to all things supernatural. You're quite right, dicussing with you (an unbeliever) is very pointless. I enjoy it nonetheless. Quite right, we see you do this all the time. Not srtange, since you are, in fact, an unbeliever. Then he isn't the only one lying. Of course not, you, being an unbeliever, will deny anything I say anyway, even though it's the truth. No you don't. No, you want to believe your personal, and very wrong, beliefs about god and so don't want to belief the truth and lead people away from it. You don't have any more details, let alone the original texts.

archaeologist,One can have a good and honest discussion with unbelievers and those believers who believe differently than yourself. The trick is to argue the position and not the person. Also abide by the rules of the forum.Rule #4: Points should be supported with evidence and/or reasoned argumentation. Address rebuttals through the introduction of additional evidence or by enlarging upon the argument. Do not repeat previous points without further elaboration. Avoid bare assertions.Providing evidence or reasoned argumentation for your opinions help to move the discussion forward.This is a debate board. People are going to disagree with you. Even on the religious side you need to be able to support your position otherwise the discussion doesn't move forward. Please direct any comments concerning this Administrative msg to the Report discussion problems here: No.2 thread.

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Participants,Please keep to the topic.Stop the wise cracks and argue the position, not the person. Please direct any comments concerning this Administrative msg to the Report discussion problems here: No.2 thread.

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These are a few.

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

Except of course not one of those supports the idea that the Bible stories would not change or be lost.Look at this one you used.

quote:

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The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times. Thou shalt keep them, O LORD, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever. (Psalms 12:6-7)

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That one is saying that the words can be trusted and that the ruler should preserve them. Nothing in there about whether or not it was done or about any of the other stories.Then you went on to list (although you did not quote) Deuteronomy 4:1-2.

quote:

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1 Hear now, O Israel, the decrees and laws I am about to teach you. Follow them so that you may live and may go in and take possession of the land that the LORD, the God of your fathers, is giving you. 2 Do not add to what I command you and do not subtract from it, but keep the commands of the LORD your God that I give you.

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Note that is specifically talking about the Laws in Deuteronomy and we know from later stories that Jesus himself as well as Peter and Paul did subtract from them.And this thread is a great example of the next one.

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God cares about every one of His words. Every word of God is pure: he is a shield unto them that put their trust in him. Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar. (Proverbs 30:5-6)

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As shown above, you guys are adding to what was actually said and changing the meanings.Finally this one.

quote:

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God's words will never pass away. Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away. (Jesus Christ, Son of God) (Mark 13:31)

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If you take that passage to mean the Bible then it appears Jesus was wrong. So far there is not one original copy of any book found in any of the different Bibles, so the originals did pass away and we do not know what Jesus or God's words were.

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Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

Jar, you're straining at straws and swallowing camels. The manuscripts we have are old enough to the originals to be near perfect. There are translations such as the ASV which have been translated literally enough to fulfill the promises cited.

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

Again, you present nothing but unsupported assertions.Where is the evidence that shows "The manuscripts we have are old enough to the originals to be near perfect. "?Unless you have the original documents how can you tell if the ones you have are accurate?AbE:In addition, of the passages that you used above the only one that seemed to mandate that content must be kept is the passage from Deuteronomy 4:1-2.As I pointed out, Jesus, Paul, Peter and others specifically said that many of the Deuteronomy Laws were no longer valid, set aside, subtracted.Edited by jar, : provide support for my points

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Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

Do you know what evidence is? Telling me to read someone's ideas on a subject is not showing evidence. FF Bruce's views are not evidence just his beliefs. By evidence I mean something tangible. If you have tangible evidence that the Bible is authoritive and truly inspired, then show it otherwise quit condemning those of us who don't accept hearsay.

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There is no better love between 2 people than mutual respect for each other WT Young, 2002Who gave anyone the authority to call me an authority on anything. WT Young, 1969Since Evolution is only ~90% correct it should be thrown out and replaced by Creation which has even a lower % of correctness. W T Young, 2008

I have.
So have many others.
His preaching is worthless as evidence.Why don't YOU present some evidence then, if it's so convincing to you?Kap

AND unless YOU have the originals YOU CANNOT say they were altered and not preserved. what do you think he has in his book? hearsay? i have quoted people and i still hear 'more evidence...' you have been given evidence and people keep rejecting it. there is a limit. read the book, read strobel's The Case for Christ, you will find plentyof evidence in those works. read Craig Evans' Fabricating Jesus. Kitchen's On the Reliability of the Old Testament. plenty of evidence found in those books as well.p.s. i do present evidence, in one forum i presented a non-christian site and which showed i was correct and it was dismissed. so the problem lies with you and your unrealistic demands.Edited by archaeologist, : No reason given.

I repeat.Again, you present nothing but unsupported assertions.Where is the evidence that shows "The manuscripts we have are old enough to the originals to be near perfect. "?Unless you have the original documents how can you tell if the ones you have are accurate?In addition, of the passages that you used above the only one that seemed to mandate that content must be kept is the passage from Deuteronomy 4:1-2.As I pointed out, Jesus, Paul, Peter and others specifically said that many of the Deuteronomy Laws were no longer valid, set aside, subtracted.Further we know for a fact that many of the stories in the Bible are not factually correct and that there is not even a single Universal Canon of what goes into a Bible.If there is not one universal list of what books should be included then how can any claim of it being authoritative or truly inspired be taken seriously?

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Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

here is the gist of it: the Bible in 2 Tim. 3:16 tells us that 'all scripture is God beathed. 2 Peter the same idea and then we couple it with the fact that NOT ONE scientific or archaeological discovery has proven the Bible false and even history has confirmed the accuracy and veracity of the Biblical record.BUT when we believers post this information we get: " well those books weren't written by hom they claim it wass' or 'those books are metaphors' or 'those books were written centuries later and hesitantly included in the canon' or there is the dismissal of the truth.IF you do not want to believe, WHY are you discussing the Bible? you will not accept logical, reasonable, truthful explanations and you do not understand its words and cannot analyze them. PLUS you do not want to live by God's rules, so anything you say is not truthful and just wastes time. it would be better for you all to go volunteer to help the people of pakistan than it would be putting more nail sin your coffin by calling God a liar, false, and blaspheming HIm, and so on.If the Bible were NOT true, as you claim, then why are you filling your time discussing something that has no bearing on your lives?BUT since you are discussing it, among other things, then you know deep down that it is true and you can't do anything about it. No matter how hard you try.

here is a great case in point:JAR keeps repeting the same thing over an dover AFTER being told repeatedly that he CANNOT claim there are errors in the mss. because he does not have the originals.he is just being obstinate and looking to cause trouble. we have the originals, God has preserved them people need to learn to accept the reality that false teachers will write their own versions to fit their beliefs. Kenneth ScottLatourette recorded this in Vol. 1 pg. 131 (i believe) of his 2 vol. work A History of Christianity.we have a modern day example in the JW's and other cults. NOW if JAR and others refuse to listen to the evidence presented then there is NO MORE EVIDENCE to present. He and others are doing exactly what he accuses us believers of doing--making blind assertions he cannot prove exist or is true.if you want evidence, then listen to it the FIRST TIME it is presented.