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Author | Topic: The Changing World Order | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Phat writes:
But you don't like the people. You don't want to be equal with them.
ringo writes:
The people decide what's necessary. You don't get to decide what's "necessary". Phat writes:
Another reason why you should throw Dalio out the window. Conservatives want to maintain their privilege. That's THEIR privilege, not yours.
According to Dalio's video, Liberals by and large want to redistribute. Conservatives want to maintain. Phat writes:
Apparently YouTube hasn't had any videos to show you the results of the recent mid-term elections. It's YOUR bunch that is being voted out. f you raise my taxes beyond a reasonable level, I will lobby to have you voted out.Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
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ringo Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Phat writes:
Stop talking about authoritarianism. You don't know what you're talking about.
My argument focuses on Liberal Authoritarianism and control. Phat writes:
More important, there is no reason to allow them to do business in a country that they refuse to support with their taxes. There's your beloved "offshore system" again, where they take their vast profits out of the country. They do have a point in that there is no reason for a man such as Bezos or Musk to even stay in this country if the people vote to supertax their wealth (rather than giving them business perks)Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
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ringo Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Phat writes:
I have explained this to you before: Money circulates. How is making the working class pay ever larger bills going to be the tide that raises all boats? I give spare change to a homeless person. He spends it on drugs. The drug dealer buys groceries at Safeway. The government taxes Safeway and spends the money on welfare. The welfare recipients buy groceries at Safeway. Safeway pays you. You pay your rent. Your landlord buys groceries at Safeway. Taxes paid to the government don't just disappear into a hole. Tax cuts for the rich DO go into a hole (overseas).Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
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ringo Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
Our city government calculated that it would take $122.5 million to "end homelessness" in the city. That would require a tax increase of $40.59 per month ($487.08 annually) per homeowner in 2023 and $11.90 per month ($142.80 annually) in 2024. Taq writes:
Who is "we"? We have more than enough money to put all homeless people into homes.Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
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ringo Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
Your belief is wrong. The government has a legal right to do whatever the Constitution doesn't forbid. And it has a moral right (and duty) to do whatever the electorate elects them to do.
I believe that even in a national crisis, the government has no right to nationalize everyone's private wealth. Phat writes:
See above. I appealed to the Constitution.
He [ringo] will appeal to emotionalism... Phat writes:
That's a completely un-Christian stance.
I stand on the right to private property and individual liberty over and above group cohesiveness. Phat writes:
Is a glitch in your mind.
Confiscatory taxation... Phat writes:
ALL government is an infringement on individual liberty and private property rights. All SOCIETY is an infringement on individual liberty and private property rights. ... infringes on individual liberty and private property rights. Remember our member Petrophysics? We haven't seen him here since he said he voted for Trump in 2016 because he did everything he promised (BEFORE he was elected, mind you.) That genius Petrophysics claims to be completely self-made with no responsibility to society. I asked him if he built the university where he learned about petrophysics or if he built the roads that he drove on to get to that university. I got no answer. And I don't suppose I'll get an answer from you either. You'll go on blathering about how you have no obligation to society.
Phat writes:
How many years have you been predicting that? And that "5 years" keeps receding into the future. When the global economy tanks,(and it will within 5 years)...Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
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ringo Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
Will you ever get it through your head that the "private interest" that you tout is not YOUR interest? You're like the poor whites who supported slavery even though it was AGAINST their own interests.
My theory is that the Democrats want the gold/money available for public interest above private interest... Phat writes:
I own macaroni.
I can only say that the IMF and most global Central Banks still own (and are buying) more gold. Phat writes:
USEFUL commodities are a safe harbor, things that people NEED, like food. Invest your money in pork bellies. Commodities are always a safe harbor in an economic storm.
Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
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ringo Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
So you should give Hitler credit too. (By the way, Hitler was an authoritarian.) nwr writes:
I'll give him 1/3 credit. Churchill and Stalin get the other two-thirds. And it was WW II and the war effort that made America an Empire... Why is it that you don't credit FDR with bringing us that prosperity?Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
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ringo Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
Next are you going to make the point that water is wet? My point is that the allied block had both conservatives and liberals involved in the war effort. Of course there were both liberals and conservatives on the Allied side. If you had read your own wiki quote, you would know that Churchill himself was both a Liberal and a Conservative. Also, you should be aware that the British Conservatives of the past were not the raving lunatic scum-sucking "conservatives" in your Republican Party today.Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
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ringo Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Phat writes:
Because you have to do the work to get one. You have to take classes you don't want to take and hear ideas you don't want to hear. You can't just turn a semester off like a YouTube video and find another one that you like better. Why are you so impressed with college degrees?Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
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ringo Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
Not much of a discussion. You call me authoritarian without knowing what it means.
We have discussed authoritarianism before. Phat writes:
I don't care what you think about gold. FDR(Democrat) seizes the publics gold....Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
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ringo Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Phat writes:
As I said in another place: That's like asking what floats a boat apart from the water? Apart from Trump and populism, what specifically is bad about the Republican Party of today? What more do you need? The Republicans let Trump get away with his crimes. What more do you need? They obstruct Congress. What more do you need?Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
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ringo Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
I haven't read much about economics or political ideology, so I can't recommend much reading. Somebody else probably can.
Lets pretend that you are the teacher. The subject is economics and political ideology. Assign me a couple of books that I wont like. Phat writes:
I just wish you'd respond to more of what I say.
Give me some work to do. Phat writes:
There's no "unified" peanut gallery.
... keeping up with the unified peanut gallery can be exhausting! Phat writes:
Lots of celebrities who don't need the money write books. What else are celebrities known for? Ego.
... I doubt he is selling the book to make money. He gives his information away for free, for crying out loud! Phat writes:
You're hardly in a position to decide who's ignorant about economics. And I would argue that he is far from ignorant regarding economics.Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
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ringo Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Phat writes:
ringo writes:
I thought i used the Dictionary! You call me authoritarian without knowing what it means.quote:When have I ever suggested anything resembling that? Phat writes:
I don't bore you in every post blathering about macaroni.
ringo writes:
Well I don't care what you think of macaroni either. I don't care what you think about gold. Phat writes:
That does illustrate what you don't understand about authoritarianism.
And if the government seized your macaroni, you might then learn what I see authoritarianism as. Phat writes:
That's a worthless what-if. Obviously, I would pay it. What if they seized your stored up box of macaroni, offered you 25 cents for it, then raised the official price of macaroni to $1.00? And it has nothing to do with authoritariansim. What if the government lowered the speed limit to 55 mph? What if the government taxed liquor and tobacco? What if the government taxed gasoline? What if the government taxed everything you buy? You need to learn that everything the government does is not necessarily authoritarian.Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
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ringo Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
Wrong. It only makes sense that a common trait of a common interest is to protect individual wealth as well as community "wealth". Right? The "common good" is not served by individual wealth. Individual wealth subtracts from community wealth. Your beloved "offshore system" streals from the community wealth in favor of individual wealth. When are you going to stop supporting Phat writes:
Stop spouting far-right propaganda and learn what Marxism is. (unless you are a far left Marxist.)Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
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ringo Member (Idle past 442 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
Stop trying to evade. ringo writes:
I need a bi-partisan government. What more do you need? In Message 141 you asked, "Apart from Trump and populism, what specifically is bad about the Republican Party of today?" In Message 142 I replied, "The Republicans let Trump get away with his crimes. What more do you need? They obstruct Congress. What more do you need?" We were talking about what is bad about the Republican Party. So answer the question I asked: What do you need besides letting Trump get away with his crimes and general obstruction of Congress?
Phat writes:
So you DON'T need a party that obstructs the duly-elected party in power.
I need a bi-partisan government. I need a two-party system. Phat writes:
Have you ever heard of co-operation? Have you ever heard of compromise? I don't "need" one collective of "we". The whole idea of democracy is to give diverse viewpoints a say.
Phat writes:
Of course we do. Do you want to just ride rough-shod over minority ideas? Again, the point of democracy IS "we", not "me".
Why? Because *we* often disagree. Phat writes:
You damn well WILL do what the government says. Who do you think you are? Che Guevara?
I wont simply have a gang of"we" telling me what I must do... Phat writes:
Your contempt for humanity is well-known. It's one of the ugliest characteristics of your ugly religion. ... in the name of ...well take your pick:in the name of humanity. (that's a laugh!) Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
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