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Author Topic:   Separation of Church and State
riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 447 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 281 of 305 (328365)
07-02-2006 10:35 PM
Reply to: Message 268 by alacrity fitzhugh
07-01-2006 8:33 PM


Re: It's up to the parents
First you answer my question. If your children are that important to you why don't you put them in a school that teaches them the way you feel is acceptable?
This is my country just as much as an atheist. I havge no problem if the schools teach about both. I pay a huge amount of school taxes, and our schools are fairly decent. I will teach my kids their faith, even if the schools omit it, and are Godless for the momment.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 268 by alacrity fitzhugh, posted 07-01-2006 8:33 PM alacrity fitzhugh has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 300 by nator, posted 07-03-2006 7:51 AM riVeRraT has not replied
 Message 304 by alacrity fitzhugh, posted 07-03-2006 9:39 AM riVeRraT has not replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 447 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 282 of 305 (328366)
07-02-2006 10:36 PM
Reply to: Message 269 by nator
07-01-2006 9:28 PM


Re: If you had kids,..... - Like ME
Yes, I would be in favor of that. If Jesus Christ is truth, then the truth will prevail.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 269 by nator, posted 07-01-2006 9:28 PM nator has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 301 by nator, posted 07-03-2006 7:53 AM riVeRraT has not replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 447 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 283 of 305 (328368)
07-02-2006 10:38 PM
Reply to: Message 270 by DrJones*
07-01-2006 9:33 PM


Re: If you had kids,..... - Like ME
That wasn't the question. Can they choose to not be exposed to this ministry?
They can't choose the way it is now.
So you support Muslims, Hindus, Sihks, Satanists coming into your school and using public money (taxes are paying for the school) to show your children what their religion is?
See my previous reply.
But you're forcing children to be exposed to Jesus. A mandatory school assembly is not a free choice.
That is entirely different from choosing Jesus in your heart. IT must be a FREE choice.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 270 by DrJones*, posted 07-01-2006 9:33 PM DrJones* has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 286 by DrJones*, posted 07-02-2006 10:44 PM riVeRraT has not replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 447 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 284 of 305 (328369)
07-02-2006 10:41 PM
Reply to: Message 272 by nator
07-01-2006 9:49 PM


Re: If you had kids,..... - Like ME
I'm sorry, you must have missed my posts to you, rat.
They can be found at:
Message #249,
Message #250
Message #251
IT seems that it is ok for you to make multiple replies, but not ok for me, as I am the one who always recieves a warning about multiple replies. If you wish to make multiple replies, try reading them all, and then condensing into one post, so it won't seem as if your flying off the handle so much, and we don't waste forum space. It makes for much nicer conversation.
{I think he might have a valid point there Schraf. Two of those messages are replies to the same RR message. To all, how about trying for fewer but better messages? And try not to pile on as much. - Adminnemooseus}
Edited by Adminnemooseus, : See above.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 272 by nator, posted 07-01-2006 9:49 PM nator has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 302 by nator, posted 07-03-2006 7:57 AM riVeRraT has not replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 447 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 285 of 305 (328370)
07-02-2006 10:44 PM
Reply to: Message 273 by MangyTiger
07-01-2006 10:08 PM


Re: To clear things up a bit...
Out of respect for the 90% of the people in this country who helped build this country, who believe this to be true, we can leave it.
IT doesn't say, you have to believe this to be part of our society, it's just the ten commandments, and part of our history. To many times people are trying to erase God from our history.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 273 by MangyTiger, posted 07-01-2006 10:08 PM MangyTiger has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 289 by Jaderis, posted 07-02-2006 11:03 PM riVeRraT has replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 447 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 287 of 305 (328372)
07-02-2006 10:50 PM
Reply to: Message 274 by RAZD
07-02-2006 2:51 PM


Re: We all have kids. They go to school to learn ...
Can you tell me how it pertains to education?
To reach people with the gospel of Jesus Christ which an ordinary church meeting or event cannot.
Schools are NOT churches, and are NOT places to preach YOUR religion, no matter WHAT it is.
Yes, it is, it is a place of learning. I am not against all religions coming to the schools and teaching.
So here you are, complaining about people "taking god out of school" etcetera, when it is YOU trying to IMPOSE it on others REGARDLESS of THEIR beliefs. You have a arrogant unmitigated gall if you want my personal opinion.
/\
So you are blocked from instigating such an ILLEGAL and IMMORAL and UNCONSTITUTIONAL imposition on PUBLIC schools, and YOU complain.
I am not imposing any specific religion, and not forcing it on anyone. IT is perfectly fine to allow kids a choice.
Why is it I have no problem letting my kids hear about atheism, or whatever. It's their choice, and they need to know about their choices, and not from some atheistic gay liberal teacher. If you don't like that then too bad.
I have been there in the schools, and it seems other thoughts other than the ones I would like to have my kids follow, are being imposed on them. So which one os right RAZD?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 274 by RAZD, posted 07-02-2006 2:51 PM RAZD has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 298 by RAZD, posted 07-03-2006 7:23 AM riVeRraT has not replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 447 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 288 of 305 (328374)
07-02-2006 10:59 PM
Reply to: Message 276 by RAZD
07-02-2006 3:09 PM


Re: You sure got gall.
ore to the point, what have YOU - riVeRraT - done to educate the kids in your school about other religions:
IT is not my job to teach kids about something I am not qualified to teach. IT is my job to allow it.
Or are you just another biased closed minded political activist christian hypocrite?
Get a life, have you not learned anythign ahbout me yet?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 276 by RAZD, posted 07-02-2006 3:09 PM RAZD has not replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 447 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 290 of 305 (328379)
07-03-2006 12:10 AM
Reply to: Message 289 by Jaderis
07-02-2006 11:03 PM


Re: To clear things up a bit...
Ya know, museums are a great place to display historical documents and artifacts.
And SOHO is a great place to meet gay people, so what?
A courthouse is no place to display the ten commandments unless we actually use them as our laws
There are many things displayed on the walls of Justice in Washington DC that are not our laws.
The other commandments have no place in a courthouse unless we live in a theocracy and actually have laws against graven images, adultery or having other gods.
The Left doesn’t want us to worship God and follow His commandments, but they would like us to worship the gods of ultra-tolerance on the graven altar of moral relativism.
Are you afraid everyone will all of a sudden become Christian because the ten commandments are on the walls of the court houses, after being there for so long?
A large majority of th enation, some 90% believe in the ten commandments, get over it. No one is forcing you to.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 289 by Jaderis, posted 07-02-2006 11:03 PM Jaderis has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 291 by nwr, posted 07-03-2006 12:27 AM riVeRraT has replied
 Message 294 by Jaderis, posted 07-03-2006 2:05 AM riVeRraT has replied
 Message 295 by ramoss, posted 07-03-2006 6:20 AM riVeRraT has replied
 Message 303 by nator, posted 07-03-2006 8:06 AM riVeRraT has not replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 447 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 292 of 305 (328389)
07-03-2006 1:08 AM
Reply to: Message 291 by nwr
07-03-2006 12:27 AM


Re: To clear things up a bit...
What they don't want, is to have the government dictate how you should worship.
By removing God from our society, and our history?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 291 by nwr, posted 07-03-2006 12:27 AM nwr has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 293 by nwr, posted 07-03-2006 1:21 AM riVeRraT has not replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 447 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 296 of 305 (328445)
07-03-2006 6:42 AM
Reply to: Message 294 by Jaderis
07-03-2006 2:05 AM


Re: To clear things up a bit...
I'm not sure which examples you are speaking of, but I suspect that they are documents from which we have derived our laws from. Like I said, the ten commandments mention a couple of things that are akin to laws that America imposes, but the rest are specific religious commandments that have nothing to do with our laws and therefore have no place in a courthouse.
That pretty much sums it up. It's ok for those other things to be there, but not the commandments?
Give me a break.
osting or not posting the ten commandments has no bearing on your faith, but it does constitute government establishment of religion
That sentence is in total condradiction with itself.
Listen, you don't see me fighting to remove Confucius, or Solon from the Supreme court building, even though they are in direct contradiction with the ten commandments. IT is what it is, and it is who and what we are. It is part of our history. I embrace all religions, and atheism. I don't think our governement is promoting any of it, if there is a statue of the ten commandments, or a statue of Tom Sawyer, or Santa Claus.
We are not promoting religion when we have paid rabbis or paid preists and ministers. It is clear to me that I live in a country where my religion is a free choice, and a statue isn't going to change that.
I don't think that Christian prayer specifically is what we need on schools, but a time for prayer in the morning, or like someone else said "a moment of silence" is a good thing. Also a fair chance at knowing about all the religions in school is fine with me also. The schools can have disclaimers and get away with it, why not? TV shows do it all the time. Too many kids come out of school knowing all the bad stuff about religion, but not the good stuff.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 294 by Jaderis, posted 07-03-2006 2:05 AM Jaderis has not replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 447 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 297 of 305 (328446)
07-03-2006 6:44 AM
Reply to: Message 295 by ramoss
07-03-2006 6:20 AM


Re: To clear things up a bit...
The conservative athiests you know, wish to impose moral relativism on the country?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 295 by ramoss, posted 07-03-2006 6:20 AM ramoss has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 299 by nwr, posted 07-03-2006 7:48 AM riVeRraT has not replied

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