Islam does not hate christianity

Turned my back for a while and another Islam thread starts. Oh well, 'tis my duty as one of the few Muslims on board to grab a scimitar and join the melee...

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And not just Constantine. The difference is simple, there is no directive in scripture to conquer, to spread by the sword.
Christ forbade his disciples to use armed force, note Peter relieving someone of his ear, and Christs response.
But that is not true of Islam. When the Protestants and Catholics of Ireland were at odds, the clergy of other nations did not incite their able-bodied to join the fight and they did not plead for money from their members to finance killing. But, that is true with Islam. Its wars and terrorism are very openly supported by Muslim groups everywhere and are encouraged from the Mosques. Why?

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And your post is wrong on two counts mister! I challenge you to back up your assertion

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The difference is simple, there is no directive in scripture to conquer, to spread by the sword.

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by quoting a Qur'an verse that says Muslims has to conquer, spread by the sword. And the other one

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wars and terrorism are very openly supported by Muslim groups everywhere and are encouraged from the Mosques.

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is also wrong, I've been around to many masjids and learned the views of various Muslim groups and so far the majority speaks against the current wave of al-Qaida franchise terrorism (which is an offshoot of the US's earlier support to Osama & the like when they were American puppets against the Soviets).

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Is Allah the god of Christians?

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Is God the god of Christians? I guess He is, but I thought the Christians' God is not God but Jesus also?

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The tax is designed to humiliate and torment. There may be more dirt poor Muslims because the religion does not reward enterprise and success, but at least they have had the privilege of pushing Christians and Jews off the sidewalks. It's fact but I have to find the research. Christians are also forbidden to own a dwelling that is taller than a Muslim's and churches must always be smaller than mosques

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care to back this statement with some real examples? Back home in Indonesia I think the Christians on average are slightly more prosperous than the majority Muslims. There are large churches and large houses owned by Christians in my hometown. You high on something or what?

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The religion says Jews must go, Israel must go, and any kind of deception is permitted in that service.

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Care to back that up? Jews had been living peacefully under Muslim rule for ages! It's only just recently that Arabs (Muslims AND Christians) got into conflict with the state of Israel, because of their terrorizing ways from 1948 on.And yes, the Qur'an criticizes Jews, but it does not imply that Muslims should exterminate Jews or anything.

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They believed they worshipped the same God, yes, but that their new revelation cancelled out the Biblical revelation and is intended to conquer the world, and those who stick to the Biblical religions are now infidels for rejecting the new revelation. The Koran changes Biblical facts, makes Ishmael Abraham's heir instead of Isaac as the Bible says, even confuses Mary the mother of Jesus with Miriam the sister of Moses. They consider this the truth and the Bible false. They changed the name of God. In the Bible God gives His N ame as YHWH, "I Am that I Am." That is His Name. It is not Allah. The name Allah was originally the name of the moon god, one of hundreds of idol gods that were housed at Mecca before Mohammed made it Muslim. Yes, Muslims believe they worship the same God, but they don't.

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I agree with part of the firs sentence. The Qur'an was intended to replace the human-corrupted Gospels and Torah.The Qur'an did not confuse Mary with Miriam, btw. There's even a whole chapter dedicated to her, telling of her account. I thought Mary was not mentioned a lot in the Bible?Allah is not a name, it is the Arabic word for 'God'. I've discussed this with Buzsaw a while ago. You might want to check this threadYHWH, Yahweh, Jehovah, adonai, lord, elohim, god, allah, Allah thread

Chris Porcelain,Thanks for your peaceful comments. Sometimes I too get distracted by those Christians who badmouth my religion without them knowing i bit of what the actual situation is.If only all Christians were like you, Jar, and several other ones that does not have hatred or misunderstanding covering their eyes (or even the atheists and agnostics here, most of them has been a nice bunch), we'd have a peaceful world.Peace brother!Q29:47
And do not argue with the people of the Scripture ('Christians, Jews') except in the best manner; except for those who are wicked amongst them; and Say: "We believe in what was revealed to us and in what was revealed to you, and our god and your god is the same; to Him we surrender."

Um, Buzsaw, I thought you already get the point back then? There is only One God, which is, God. If He chooses not to assign a name to Himself, and only reveals to us that He is God, the One ('Qul Huwa Allahu ahad'), then I have no problem with that.I thought only polytheists which had more than one god needs to assign names to their gods... Zeus, Loki, Amaterasu...Besides, I'm still inclined to think that 'YHWH' equals the Qur'anic 'Huwa' (like the one in the verse I quoted before), which literally just means 'He'.

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Unless you count Spain, Yugoslavia, and parts of Austria, Romania, and Hungary.

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Well it is a fact that Muslims expanded into Europe, first to Spain, and much later the Ottoman Turks into the Balkans. But I thought Christianity also spread into Europe by lending the Roman Empire's hand?

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But you raise a good point about Muslim religious tolerance. In Spain Jews lived quite tolerably under the Caliphs until Ferdinand and Isabella brought Christian rule and inquisition. Talk about your conversion by the sword!

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Indeed, and this is a point us Muslims are always proud of. After the end of Muslim rule in Spain, Jews were oppressed. So some of them fled to North Africa--under Ottoman Turk rule at that time.The Ottomans were also tolerant of non-Muslims under their rule, so tolerant that many of their high officials were Christians and Jews!

Summoning the mighty admins... topic veering off course... this is not the 'Islam does/does not hate Israel' thread...Faith, I assume you, like Buz and other apocalyptic-minded Christians, is obsessed with Israel and itching to pick a fight with the world so Jesus will return and lift you guys to Heaven and send the rest of us Muslims atheists & so to Hell, so it's natural that this topic would turn from a discussion of the relationship between Islam & Christianity into Israel v Palestine. But can't you at least acknowledge the circumstances of Jazzns? I mean, Jazzns is a living example that this unhealthy obsession with Israel is damaging even to your fellow Christians (Although I doubt you would consider him as one of you, given that comment about Palestinian Christians "on the side of terrorists").

I once had a stalemate discussion with Buzsaw about the nature of war verses in the Qur'an, here:EvC Forum: Fundamental Biblical Christianity and Fundamental Islam Fundamentally 180% OppositesStart with my reply on message 82.I can't write much at the moment but I'm keeping an eye on this. And Faith, you are just taking Qur'an verses out of context. Again.The Qur'an only said that violence is allowed in defense. Period.
2:178 is about retaliating. This is allowed in Islam.
2:190 is 'fight those who fight you'. Defense.
2:193 and 2:216 is about fighting against oppression. That's a reason.
The chapter 3 verses relate to the Battle of Uhud, which is an attack to Muslims in Medina by Mecca pagans. So they're all about defense.
4:89 is about violence against 'the hypocrites', a group of people that backstabbed the early Muslim community.
4:100 is not about fighting, it's about fleeing persecution (seeking asylum)! The translation's inaccurate.If you have issues with that please specify.Now if you could be so kind in singling out one Qur'anic verse that tell me to do offensive violence against non-Muslims...

Your problem with Islam is caused by a list of Islam-hating websites?Then the solution of the problem is stop reading them and try to do a discussion with your local knowledgeable Muslims. That should clear things up! I know you're just misinformed.This message has been edited by Andya Primanda, 02-27-2005 11:10 AM