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Author | Topic: The Bible on Sex, Love, and Marriage | |||||||||||||||||||||||
dpardo Inactive Member |
Arachnophilia writes: quote: The text does say that and, taken out of context, it can be used to support your view. But, the text also says:
25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it; Ephesians 5:25 The model here is that we should love our wives as Christ loved the church. How did Christ love the church?
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dpardo Inactive Member |
Schrafinator writes: quote: But see, that's not what the evidence shows. The evidence shows that, by definition, these roles lead to the highest divorce rates among all groups. The lowest divorce rates come from non-believers. Sadly, you are correct that the "Christian" marriages do not appear to have a lower divorce rate than those of non-believers. I believe that the failed Christian marriages are as much in need of understanding and applying these doctrines as anyone else.
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dpardo Inactive Member |
Schrafinator writes: Do you have a best friend? Which one of you has the "authority" to make descisions for your relationship if you both disagree about something? What usually ends up happening if your best friend and you disagree on a course of action?
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dpardo Inactive Member |
I appreciate your time and patience with me.
I have to go off-line now, but I will try to get to your questions this weekend or Monday!
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nator Member (Idle past 2200 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
quote: Well, if it's a really major descision then we talk about it until we come to a mutual agreement that takes into account both of our opinions, wants, and needs. If it is a minor "where do you want to go to get dinner"-type issue, then whoever feels the most strongly in their opinion, or whoever has the best reasoning for why to go to one retaurant over another gets to decide, usually. Sometimes it is me who gets to decide, and sometimes it is my best friend.
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nator Member (Idle past 2200 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
quote: The problem in the Bible is that it lays out marriage/family as an extremely hierarchical construct. 1) God 2) Man 3) Woman What kind of adult relationship can you ever hope to have with a woman if you view her as lower than you on the hierarchy?
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arachnophilia Member (Idle past 1375 days) Posts: 9069 From: god's waiting room Joined: |
The model here is that we should love our wives as Christ loved the church. How did Christ love the church? i get the feeling you didn't read my post.
quote:
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dpardo Inactive Member |
Schrafinator,
Have you ever had a situation with your friend where you couldn't agree? If so, what happened?
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dpardo Inactive Member |
Schrafinator writes: What kind of adult relationship can you ever hope to have with a woman if you view her as lower than you on the hierarchy? You don't have to view her as "lower". She is equal to you. We simply have different roles.
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dpardo Inactive Member |
Does God care about how men treat their wives...
13 And this have ye done again, covering the altar of the LORD with tears, with weeping, and with crying out, insomuch that he regardeth not the offering any more, or receiveth it with good will at your hand. Malachi 2:13-17
14 Yet ye say, Wherefore? Because the LORD hath been witness between thee and the wife of thy youth, against whom thou hast dealt treacherously: yet is she thy companion, and the wife of thy covenant. 15 And did not he make one? Yet had he the residue of the spirit. And wherefore one? That he might seek a godly seed. Therefore take heed to your spirit, and let none deal treacherously against the wife of his youth. 16 For the LORD, the God of Israel, saith that he hateth putting away: for one covereth violence with his garment, saith the LORD of hosts: therefore take heed to your spirit, that ye deal not treacherously. 17 Ye have wearied the LORD with your words. Yet ye say, Wherein have we wearied him? When ye say, Every one that doeth evil is good in the sight of the LORD, and he delighteth in them; or, Where is the God of judgment?
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nator Member (Idle past 2200 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
quote: But a leader and a follower in an intimate love relationship are not, by definition, equal. The only time I have ever been a follower in a personal relationship is when I was a child under the leadership of my parents and older siblings. Would you say that a child is equal to the parent in their relationship? Besides, the Bible rather clearly indicates that women and men are not equal, and that men are to rule over women: Gen 3:16Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to [b]thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.[i] I Cor 11:7For a man indeed ought not to cover his head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man. 11:8For the man is not of the woman: but the woman of the man. 11:9Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man. It is very clear in even a cursory reading of the Bible that women are not equal to men, but are subservient to men.
quote: Separate but equal? Where have I heard that before?
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nator Member (Idle past 2200 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
But this is just an admonition to not be "treacherous".
It doesn't say anything about treating her as an equal adult.
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nator Member (Idle past 2200 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
quote: Well, in the case of one best frind, we are no longer friends. In the case of my most best friend (my husband), we just keep working at it until we reach a compromise that is acceptable to both of us. Since we are quite compatable and want the best for each other, the give and take all evens out in the end.
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nator Member (Idle past 2200 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
dpardo, I kind of feel like you skirted a major point of min that I made in a previous message...
quote: But if a husband ultimately has the final say, isn't that an awful lot like a parent/child relationship?
When the man and wife, who are both mature adults, disagree, why should the man always have the final say, as if he is the parent and she is the child? That a man should want his wife to submit to his dominance in this way is really icky. That a woman should be taught to always submit to another's will to be a good wife is demeaning. An adult relationship is one where neither person can simply overrule the other's will.
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dpardo Inactive Member |
Hi Schrafinator,
I have to go off-line now but I will certainly get to your questions as quickly as I can. It may not be until Monday, but I will get back to you. Thanks!
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