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Author
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Topic: The Bible on Sex, Love, and Marriage
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asciikerr
Inactive Member
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Message 76 of 302 (151100)
10-19-2004 1:15 PM
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Reply to: Message 74 by Coragyps
10-19-2004 12:14 PM
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Companionship
"you can only become one if you have two equals coming together" Coragyps says: quote:
Where did this absurdity come from? That makes no sense on any level whatever, not even arithmetical!
The answer your looking for is found in Companionship.The Hebrew word for "companionship" is khaw-bare, it literally means to be knit together with another person. The Bible explains that this process of knitting together should take place when two believers love each other. Companionship in marriage is like knitting a beautiful sweater, choosing daily to intertwine your lives together. Every time you choose companionship over independence and selfishness it becomes one more stitch in your sweater. This knitting requires your careful attention and a willingness to devote lots of time and work to accomplish the task set before you. In Col 2:2, Paul prayed for the Colossian Church "that their hearts may be encouraged being knit together in love..." If believers in Christ are to share in this togetherness, how much more for a husband and wife who love each other. To have a man and a woman who have given and pledged themselves to companionship with each other before the Lord is just awesome. Allowing God to knit their hearts together in the most intimate companionship that could possibly exist between two people. Man and Woman are Equal in God's Eyes, yet one apart from the other makes them incomplete. They being incomplete w/o the other are are to come together as One. Does that make more sense? If that's to theological, then don't get me started on the Church Body.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 74 by Coragyps, posted 10-19-2004 12:14 PM | | Coragyps has not replied |
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Dan Carroll
Inactive Member
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Message 77 of 302 (151102)
10-19-2004 1:29 PM
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Reply to: Message 75 by asciikerr
10-19-2004 12:59 PM
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Re: Equality...
May I recommend a not-so-short read on the Origin of Man's Headship. Genesis helps clarify the equality and gender distinctions. Man and woman are equals in nature because they share the same human flesh, bone and spiritual value before God. Adam was already functioning as the "headship" over Eve before the "Fall of Man" came about. I already read this, and responded to it in the first post. What's more is, I didn't ask when it started, I asked why it's automatically deserved.
"If I had to write ten jokes about potholders, I don't think I could do it. But I could write ten jokes about Catholicism in the next twenty minutes. I guess I'm drawn to religion because I can be provocative without harming something people really care about, like their cars." -George Meyer, Simpsons writer
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 75 by asciikerr, posted 10-19-2004 12:59 PM | | asciikerr has not replied |
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dpardo
Inactive Member
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Message 78 of 302 (151104)
10-19-2004 1:35 PM
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Wow! I've missed quite a bit here. Asciikerr, I agree with what you said but you misquoted me here:
quote:
quote:
dpardo says: "It is very clear in even a cursory reading of the Bible that women are not equal to men, but are subservient to men."
I didn't say that. I was quoting somebody else that said it to me!
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dpardo
Inactive Member
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Message 79 of 302 (151105)
10-19-2004 1:37 PM
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Reply to: Message 65 by NosyNed
10-18-2004 9:47 PM
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Re: Not always
Hi NosyNed, You wrote:
I know from personal experience over 2 decades that you are wrong. That's awesome! You've been married for more than 20 years?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 65 by NosyNed, posted 10-18-2004 9:47 PM | | NosyNed has not replied |
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PaulK
Member Posts: 17828 Joined: 01-10-2003 Member Rating: 2.5
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Message 80 of 302 (151107)
10-19-2004 1:54 PM
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Reply to: Message 75 by asciikerr
10-19-2004 12:59 PM
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Divorce rates
According to Barna, born-again Christians are as likely to divorce as non-Christians http://www.barna.org/FlexPage.aspx?Page=BarnaUpdate&Barna... An earlier study even indicated "born-again" Christians were more likely to be divorced Archives - Baptist Standard (Note that the 2004 study reports the proportion of divorces among those who have been married, while the earlier survey reports the proportion over the total population - and thus a lower figure) I also note that the strong Catholic disapproval of divorce seems to be a more significant deterrant than any Biblical rules on marriage:
quote:
Catholics were substantially less likely than Protestants to get divorced (25% versus 39%, respectively).
(from 1st link).
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 75 by asciikerr, posted 10-19-2004 12:59 PM | | asciikerr has replied |
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dpardo
Inactive Member
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Message 81 of 302 (151135)
10-19-2004 3:44 PM
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Reply to: Message 80 by PaulK
10-19-2004 1:54 PM
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Re: Divorce rates
Hi PaulK, You wrote:
According to Barna, born-again Christians are as likely to divorce as non-Christians Yes, but your use of this statistic here assumes that born-again Christians are following the biblical plan for marriage. I do not think that is the case with these failed marriages.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 80 by PaulK, posted 10-19-2004 1:54 PM | | PaulK has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 83 by PaulK, posted 10-19-2004 4:48 PM | | dpardo has replied |
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dpardo
Inactive Member
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Message 82 of 302 (151136)
10-19-2004 3:50 PM
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When you become a Christian, you begin as a new creation. As you read the bible, you learn and begin to apply these principles in your daily living. The change to Christ-like behavior does not happen instantaneously. It is a life-long process that we strive (with God's help) to accomplish.
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PaulK
Member Posts: 17828 Joined: 01-10-2003 Member Rating: 2.5
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Message 83 of 302 (151145)
10-19-2004 4:48 PM
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Reply to: Message 81 by dpardo
10-19-2004 3:44 PM
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Re: Divorce rates
I am afraid that you do not understand statistics. For a start if you wish to attribute the 35% figure to not following your "Biblical plan" then that means that only 65% have followed them. But the big problem is that the rate is the same for non-Christians. Don't you think it likely that significantly more born-agains follow that "plan" than non-Christians ? But if they do then it has no effect on marital success at all. And THAT is my point.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 81 by dpardo, posted 10-19-2004 3:44 PM | | dpardo has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 85 by dpardo, posted 10-19-2004 5:05 PM | | PaulK has replied |
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macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3958 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: 05-24-2004
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Message 84 of 302 (151149)
10-19-2004 5:00 PM
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Reply to: Message 82 by dpardo
10-19-2004 3:50 PM
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don't you mean the change to paul-like behaviour? jesus never condemned anyone. jesus supported peace. jesus sought to bring love. paul sought to divide brother from brother based on differing belief and "sin". jesus never said to remove someone from your life because they were sinful. sorry. that was off-topic. but still. it could apply to the given situation. paul says that if your spouse leaves the church, it is as if you were never married. This message has been edited by brennakimi, 10-19-2004 04:01 PM This message has been edited by brennakimi, 10-19-2004 04:01 PM
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 82 by dpardo, posted 10-19-2004 3:50 PM | | dpardo has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 86 by dpardo, posted 10-19-2004 5:15 PM | | macaroniandcheese has replied |
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dpardo
Inactive Member
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Message 85 of 302 (151152)
10-19-2004 5:05 PM
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Reply to: Message 83 by PaulK
10-19-2004 4:48 PM
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Re: Divorce rates
PaulK writes: For a start if you wish to attribute the 35% figure to not following your "Biblical plan" then that means that only 65% have followed them. But the big problem is that the rate is the same for non-Christians. Don't you think it likely that significantly more born-agains follow that "plan" than non-Christians ? But if they do then it has no effect on marital success at all. And THAT is my point. I agree with your statement that it is likely that significantly more born-agains follow that "plan" than non-Christians. Personally, I don't think that is the case. It is my belief that the "Church" is currently sorely lacking in this area and that, in general, the Church needs to get back to teaching/preaching basic bible doctrine. The Church, to an extent, has been weakened and affected by the culture in its effort to reach people. The simple fact that some churches are even considering homosexual marriages is a testament to this trend.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 83 by PaulK, posted 10-19-2004 4:48 PM | | PaulK has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 87 by PaulK, posted 10-19-2004 5:18 PM | | dpardo has replied |
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dpardo
Inactive Member
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Hi Brennakimi, You wrote:
jesus never condemned anyone. Matthew 23 12-39 says:
12 And whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted.
13 But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.
14 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation.
15 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves.
16 Woe unto you, ye blind guides, which say, Whosoever shall swear by the temple, it is nothing; but whosoever shall swear by the gold of the temple, he is a debtor!
17 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gold, or the temple that sanctifieth the gold?
18 And, Whosoever shall swear by the altar, it is nothing; but whosoever sweareth by the gift that is upon it, he is guilty.
19 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift?
20 Whoso therefore shall swear by the altar, sweareth by it, and by all things thereon.
21 And whoso shall swear by the temple, sweareth by it, and by him that dwelleth therein.
22 And he that shall swear by heaven, sweareth by the throne of God, and by him that sitteth thereon.
23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.
24 Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.
25 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess.
26 Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.
27 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness.
28 Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity.
29 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous,
30 And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.
31 Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets.
32 Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers.
33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?
34 Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:
35 That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.
36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.
37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!
38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.
39 For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.
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PaulK
Member Posts: 17828 Joined: 01-10-2003 Member Rating: 2.5
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Message 87 of 302 (151157)
10-19-2004 5:18 PM
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Reply to: Message 85 by dpardo
10-19-2004 5:05 PM
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Re: Divorce rates
Which "the Church" ? The Catholic Church does well. It's the more conservative denominations and the non-denominationals that tend to do worse. Did you even look at the pages I linked to ?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 85 by dpardo, posted 10-19-2004 5:05 PM | | dpardo has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 89 by dpardo, posted 10-19-2004 5:48 PM | | PaulK has replied |
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macaroniandcheese
Suspended Member (Idle past 3958 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: 05-24-2004
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Message 88 of 302 (151167)
10-19-2004 5:46 PM
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Reply to: Message 86 by dpardo
10-19-2004 5:15 PM
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sorry. qualifier. jesus never condemned anyone save those who abused others. and those who mispracticed jewish faith. immaterial. he freed adulterers and hung out with criminals. that's what i mean. the people that paul abuses... paul, who says you can be a christian without following christ in his jewishness. funny thing that.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 86 by dpardo, posted 10-19-2004 5:15 PM | | dpardo has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 90 by dpardo, posted 10-19-2004 5:50 PM | | macaroniandcheese has replied |
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dpardo
Inactive Member
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Message 89 of 302 (151168)
10-19-2004 5:48 PM
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Reply to: Message 87 by PaulK
10-19-2004 5:18 PM
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Re: Divorce rates
I am speaking of the majority of all Churches, in general. Yes I did look at the pages.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 87 by PaulK, posted 10-19-2004 5:18 PM | | PaulK has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 92 by PaulK, posted 10-19-2004 6:21 PM | | dpardo has replied |
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dpardo
Inactive Member
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Brennakimi writes: the people that paul abuses... paul, who says you can be a christian without following christ in his jewishness. funny thing that. Can you please elaborate on this.
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