Then I guess a more specific explanation from dennis is need. What did he mean by "lowest levels" of melanin.
We all have same amount or "levels", just not the same type. I don't see why "lowest" or "more" is needed. It would be more accurate to say that we have different types of melanin that cause different variations in skin pigmentation.
Just to note, these different types of melanin also vary the color of hair and eyes, so its not just skin that melanin effects. Also, individual people can have a combination of the different types so they'll vary in not only skin but eye color, hair, etc. A black person can have the dark skin but also have light eyes, produced by having different combinations of melanin types. And vice versa; white people can have different combos producing unique variations in their skin, eyes, hair, etc.
To me, it is not accurate nor suffice to simply say, white people have the lowest levels and black people have the most. I was hoping that dennis clarified what he meant though.
I was hoping that dennis clarified what he meant though.
Re-read what he wrote...
He was talking about the whole "only a loss of information" thing. If white people did have less melanin and that was a reduction in information then Adam and Eve would have been black because they woulda had so much more melanin.
Oh, sure, he's just plain old wrong, but what he meant seemed to be fairly clear.
Yeah, that's what I though too, but Wounded King and Slev threw me off with their replies. I thought I made a mistake. I only know of this subject from a book I read about 2 years ago, so WK's opinion esp. I would listen to.
That's the information I'm not sure about. Is that right ? Are you sure it's not a mixt of both different types and different concentrations ?
Shit now I'm confused myself.
Working from pure memory serves me no good, so this is currently what I could find: Melanogenesis
quote:The difference in skin color between fair people and dark people is due not to the number (quantity) of melanocytes in their skin, but to the melanocytes' level of activity (quantity and relative amounts of eumelanin and pheomelanin). This process is under hormonal control, including the MSH and ACTH peptides that are produced from the precursor proopiomelanocortin. Albinos lack an enzyme called tyrosinase. Tyrosinase is required for melanocytes to produce melanin from the amino acid tyrosine.
Although human beings generally possess a similar concentration of melanocytes in their skin, the melanocytes in some individuals and ethnic groups more frequently or less frequently express the melanin-producing genes, thereby conferring a greater or lesser concentration of skin melanin.
My understand is, it's the different amount or mixture of types of polymers (such as Eumelanin, Pheomelanin or Neuromelanin) that varies the skin pigmentation. So its not that you have more melanin or less melanin, its that you have more of a certain kind of polymer.
Maybe a better way to say it is, we all have the same amount of melanocytes just different polymers. Maybe?
If someone with more knowledge on this cares to explain it I'm more than willing to be shown where I am wrong.
I think you have an almost equally over simplified approach as Denis here. Having the same number of melanocytes means nothing, they only produce the melanin so the same number of melanocytes doesn't mean the same amount of melanin.
The only well characterised genetic determinant of skin colour at the moment is the types of Melanocortin1receptor (MC1R) an individual has, and there are over 60 identified human MC1R alleles (Rees, 2004).
The article I cite above states ...
Melanin is biosynthesized within melanosomes that, when mature, are passed to the surrounding keratinocytes. Visible skin color is therefore the result of the melanin in keratinocytes but is synthesized in melanocytes.
Studies of epidermal melanins (rather than hair melanins) are fewbecause they require skin biopsiesbut suggest that those with black skin have 2—3-fold as much melanin as Northern Europeans ...
I think you have an almost equally over simplified approach as Denis here
Damn, and here I was thinking I made it too complex.
Having the same number of melanocytes means nothing, they only produce the melanin so the same number of melanocytes doesn't mean the same amount of melanin.
Yeah I think I get that now having read it over a few times. So would it be more accurate to say we all have the same amount of melanocytes, we just have different active polymers that result in different skin pigmentation?
"He was talking about the whole "only a loss of information" thing. If white people did have less melanin and that was a reduction in information then Adam and Eve would have been black because they woulda had so much more melanin."
This is exactly the only point I was trying to get across. If creation is true, then God is the source of all information, so information could only be lost over time. Though mutations can occur, it would be the result of pre-existing information.
Adam and eve would have been black.
I hope everyone did not read too much into my generalization. I was more interested in making the point that useful information cannot be gained over time. Sorry.
Though mutations can occur, it would be the result of pre-existing information
Are you saying that the cells that experienced this mutation had pre-existing information that caused the mutation, that all of this information is front-loaded? Or that the mutation changed the existing information into something different?
If front-loading, what evidence do you have?
If into something different, isn't this the exact thing you are arguing against?
In your view, somehow Adam and Eve had the information to construct all 60 alleles of MC1R. Then once again, information for all 60 of these alleles just happened to be found in Noah's 3 sons and their daughters. That is a lot of front-loading for which there is no evidence.
"Pure nonsense. There is just as much carbon 14 at the north and south poles as anywhere else -- it's in the atmosphere!
And C14 dating is not a parent-daughter dating method."
I'm refering to the NEWER forms of Parent-Daughter dating, poopdink. Such as K-Ar, Ar-Ar, etc.
Carbon levels are constantly changing, since the van allen belt is constantly changing (the belt that traps radiation around the earth...but you knew that right?).
And since most all animals get their source of carbon from plants, any area where plants to not exist, would not take carbon from the atomsphere, giving any animals in these areas false readings. This is also true with marine life, and should be called into question as well.