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Author Topic:   Who hurts the US Healthcare system worse?
Modulous
Member
Posts: 7801
From: Manchester, UK
Joined: 05-01-2005


Message 234 of 316 (716441)
01-16-2014 1:55 PM
Reply to: Message 233 by Stile
01-16-2014 1:47 PM


Re: Obamacare - Good or Bad or still waiting to see?
Does anyone have any positive anecdotes about it?
Nonreligious Questions
quote:
So, instead of $7200 per year for catastrophic insurance for Carol and I, plus paying out about $10,000 out of pocket each year due to the high deductible and pre-existing conditionswe will pay either $1200 or $3600 per year for a damned sight better coverage and much fewer out of pocket expenses.
Obama deal to bail out insurance companies if new heath care doesn't make them money
There is provision to mitigate losses to them caused by increased cost to them. Not ideal, but that's capitalism for you.
First of all - there will be fund set up (paid for not by the government, but by a fee on insurance premiums. It is a reinsurance scheme, and it entirely common. This fund will contribute costs towards particularly expensive medical bills over $45k dollars. It helps prevent the insurance companies from going bankrupt in the face of large unexpected expenses.
The second provision, the 'ESTABLISHMENT OF RISK CORRIDORS FOR PLANS IN INDIVIDUAL AND SMALL GROUP MARKETS;' is kind of difficult to understand. As far as I can tell, after reinsurances and the like, if an insurance company pays more in benefits than they take in premiums they get a payout (and if they don't they pay a fine). The idea here is, I think, to provide confidence to the market that the insurance companies will have a readjustment period so unexpected consequences of ACA won't cause chaos. After a few years, they should have figured out their new costs and the scheme ends.
80% of doctors may quit because of Obamacare
Wow, really? A study performed by a group dedicated to repealing Obamacare as reported by a Fox News author found some frightening conclusion about Obamacare. It must be true then
Edited by Modulous, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 233 by Stile, posted 01-16-2014 1:47 PM Stile has replied

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 Message 239 by Stile, posted 01-20-2014 11:43 AM Modulous has seen this message but not replied

  
Modulous
Member
Posts: 7801
From: Manchester, UK
Joined: 05-01-2005


(1)
Message 254 of 316 (716798)
01-21-2014 2:57 PM
Reply to: Message 252 by New Cat's Eye
01-21-2014 12:56 PM


Re: Good is related to ability,
UK: Salaried GPs who are part of a CCG earn between 54,319 to 81,969
USA: The general practitioner in the United States receives an average yearly salary ranging from between $168,550 to $173,175 per year.
So in US, the pay is twice that of Britain. The language is the same, and the culture is not drastically different. Why does Britain have any doctors?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 252 by New Cat's Eye, posted 01-21-2014 12:56 PM New Cat's Eye has replied

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 Message 255 by New Cat's Eye, posted 01-21-2014 3:18 PM Modulous has replied

  
Modulous
Member
Posts: 7801
From: Manchester, UK
Joined: 05-01-2005


Message 256 of 316 (716809)
01-21-2014 3:38 PM
Reply to: Message 255 by New Cat's Eye
01-21-2014 3:18 PM


Re: Good is related to ability,
Why wouldn't they?
Because they could get paid twice what they do, for largely the same job, in the US.
Unless you are suggesting that there is a realistic prospect of US doctor's salaries more than halving - why would we worry about any significant brain drain happening?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 255 by New Cat's Eye, posted 01-21-2014 3:18 PM New Cat's Eye has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 257 by New Cat's Eye, posted 01-21-2014 4:27 PM Modulous has replied

  
Modulous
Member
Posts: 7801
From: Manchester, UK
Joined: 05-01-2005


Message 258 of 316 (716820)
01-21-2014 4:39 PM
Reply to: Message 257 by New Cat's Eye
01-21-2014 4:27 PM


Re: Good is related to ability,
Isn't there a lot higher percentage of foreign-born/trained doctors in the UK as compared to the US? Could that reflect the pay disparity?
I don't follow your point. There are a lot of foreign born doctors in the UK. Why are they doctoring in the UK and not the US?
RAZD mentioned limiting doctors' pay. I'm saying that could cause a loss to the high-end doctors, who are superior in their practice, and who also command a higher pay. But I'm sure there's plenty of scrubs (heh) who could come in and fill the slots if they did decide to retire. I'd just prefer to have the access to the better (best) doctors.
So logically, the US should pay doctors more?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 257 by New Cat's Eye, posted 01-21-2014 4:27 PM New Cat's Eye has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 259 by New Cat's Eye, posted 01-21-2014 4:48 PM Modulous has replied

  
Modulous
Member
Posts: 7801
From: Manchester, UK
Joined: 05-01-2005


Message 262 of 316 (716851)
01-21-2014 6:53 PM
Reply to: Message 259 by New Cat's Eye
01-21-2014 4:48 PM


Re: Good is related to ability,
So logically, the US should pay doctors more?
No, that's not logical. Being paid more doesn't necessarily mean being better.
You said that we should not pay doctors less. The reason was to retain talent. Therefore, in order to ensure we retain the best talent (your goal) we should pay more. Unless you think that by some fluke the US is paying doctors precisely the right amount to keep the best doctors doctoring we should logically increase their wages.
Being paid more doesn't necessarily mean being better.
You are saying that paying them less 'could cause a loss to the high-end doctors, who are superior in their practice, and who also command a higher pay.'. You want to retain the top doctors? Want to encourage the finest minds into medicine? It seems the only reasonable thing to do would be to increase the pay. The best, after all, 'command a higher pay' so why are you trying to destroy the American health care system by not providing a higher pay?
The logical conclusion would be that the US shouldn't disincentivise the best doctors by preventing them from earning a higher pay.
Exactly. So you think they should earn 'higher pay', to avoid disincentivising the best. You think that the US' finest minds are in medicine right now? No! The best {potential} doctors are disencintivised by the current pay. So we should raise it!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 259 by New Cat's Eye, posted 01-21-2014 4:48 PM New Cat's Eye has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 263 by New Cat's Eye, posted 01-22-2014 10:35 AM Modulous has replied

  
Modulous
Member
Posts: 7801
From: Manchester, UK
Joined: 05-01-2005


Message 267 of 316 (716911)
01-22-2014 2:00 PM
Reply to: Message 263 by New Cat's Eye
01-22-2014 10:35 AM


Re: Good is related to ability,
I said that we shouldn't artificially limit doctors' profits.
I'm pretty sure doctors' wages are already limited by artifice.
Paying them more doesn't ensure a higher quality.
No, but apparently it ensures the talent pool is of higher quality.
Its just that a doctor should be able to earn a higher pay by providing a better service.
The proposal of limiting the maximum possible wage doesn't prohibit this performance related wages.

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 Message 263 by New Cat's Eye, posted 01-22-2014 10:35 AM New Cat's Eye has seen this message but not replied

  
Modulous
Member
Posts: 7801
From: Manchester, UK
Joined: 05-01-2005


Message 301 of 316 (717613)
01-29-2014 3:59 PM
Reply to: Message 298 by New Cat's Eye
01-29-2014 9:59 AM


Re: Good is related to ability,
Like, I have some money and I know a doctor, would I be able to give him my money for his service under single payer system? Or would it have to come from the single-payer?
Here in the UK you can opt to pay for private healthcare through someone like Bupa, and you can pay for this with private health insurance or out of your own back pocket. I've had a few issues that I've dealt with privately during the times I could afford to do so.

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