God: Knowable or not Knowable?

Has Dr. Adequate been listening to our chat room conversations, Jon?Note to Lurkers: Jon and I already discussed the symbolism of humans relating to cats as a metaphor for God relating to humans!

Well, I wonder if the dog (or cat) would rather hang out with other dogs or with their human master? (If they had a choice)

If I were a dog, I may seek my "own kind" to find 'Tang, but I would prefer hanging out with my Master who could provide me with ample table scraps, scruffy neck rubs, and who even talked to me in the hopes that we could understand each other!! Edited by Phat, : No reason given.

I said: (If I were a Dog)I would prefer hanging out with my Master who could provide me with ample table scraps, scruffy neck rubs Indeed. But the dog protects the house, fetches the paper, and does his best to provide a companion to the wife and kids. I like going on morning runs with him, too! (theooretically) First, this analogy is incomplete since unlike God, I am not a conure mind reader. But since you ask, I would say that my bird knows that when she squawks, I will check her food and water. She knows that when I want her to come out of the cage, she has to nip me to let me know she is uninterested. She always makes up by kissing me, though. Hey, she is just a bird, after all!

I see your point. But lets assume that I knw the bird better than even she did. Lets assume that it was irrelevant if she understood how I do the things I do. What is relevant is the love and trust that she gets from me.Now...if sometime in eons past, I foreknew that her and her cousins needed a sign, IF I were omnipotent, I could send my offspring (which was actually also me) and they would become a bird. Going among the birds, my offspring would spread love and give all the birds hope!actually, I know this is all rather silly, but I'm cooking lunch right now and not really thinking about this reply......

Yes

Sure. You can understand soccer and I cannot as well. I can observe it and watch it, but I can't play it and may not understand all the rules.

Phat thinks a moment...It appears that if what you are saying is correct, the limitation in the relationship totally depends on my willingness to learn more about the entity with whom I am having the relationship with.Thus, my answer is yes. Knowing the other person/cat/bird is directly related to the depth of the relationship.For example, I couldn't just pick up any old bird and have as deep of a relationship as Icarus and I have. (ewwwww, I know! )I have gotten to know you online wise through a years worth of conversations, and I couldn't simply talk to another lad from Minnesota and have anywhere near the quality of conversation that we sometimes have...(nor anywhere near the arguments!)Where are you going with this, Jon? Note the title of the thread, now.... Edited by Phat, : fixed wee error

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"All that we call human history--money, poverty, ambition, war, prostitution, classes, empires, slavery--[is] the long terrible story of man trying to find something other than God which will make him happy."--C.S.Lewis
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“The world has achieved brilliance without wisdom, power without conscience. Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants.”--General Omar Bradley
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"The free man owns himself. He can damage himself with either eating or drinking; he can ruin himself with gambling. If he does he is certainly a damn fool, and he might possibly be a damned soul; but if he may not, he is not a free man any more than a dog." -GK Chesterson

Of course! Thats why He needed Jesus! No way could humans comprehend or even talk to God the Father. (Trinitarian Defense)[/theobabble]

Well, I won't challenge you argument that asserts that Jesus is both irrelevant and dead. Thats something that none of can know based on our own investigation. Might it be possible, however, for the other party to inform us?If I am theobabbling, please consider that I have nothing further to say and that you can consider your argument supportable based on your own chosen belief. You Sunk My Babbleship! Edited by Phat, : No reason given.Edited by Phat, : No reason given.

Thanks! You said it better than I could!

OK...so putting all this logic stuff aside for a moment, can I ask a simple question?I think that it is relevant whether or not we humans want to know God or not. I personally talk to Him almost every day and I certainly don't need evidence to support my belief. I have no problem talking...and no problem believing that God is listening. I suppose in conclusion, I can say that whether or not God is knowable is unprovable...and that proof is irrelevant to belief.

IF God exists, your logical analysis certainly won't find Him. God finds you....you don't find Him! (No, I can't support it...but I'll be darned if I'm conceding anything! We simply disagree as to the methodology of belief.)

A Dog, girlfriend, or friend can only do so much. I certainly wouldnt trust my heart and soul to any of them as I would with God. Of course this reflects the fact that my belief presupposes that God is actively involved and concerned about my day to day feelings and actions.

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"All that we call human history--money, poverty, ambition, war, prostitution, classes, empires, slavery--[is] the long terrible story of man trying to find something other than God which will make him happy."--C.S.Lewis
* * * * * * * * * *
“The world has achieved brilliance without wisdom, power without conscience. Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants.”--General Omar Bradley
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Homer Simpson: Sometimes, Marge, you just have to go with your gut!
Marge: You *always* go with your gut! How about for once you listen to your brain?

::Phat goes into the quotemine...:::Phil 1:3-6--I thank my God every time I remember you. In all my prayers for all of you, I always pray with joy because of your partnership in the gospel from the first day until now, being confident of this, that he who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.What that quote means to me (or perhaps what I was taught) is that God began the work in me and that God will finish the work in me.Whats so evil about that?