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Author Topic:   The psychology of political correctness
Jon
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 11 of 309 (778836)
02-24-2016 7:36 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Blue Jay
02-24-2016 1:39 PM


The Other, Multiculturalism, and the Villainization of Dissent
How could that be?
It's the silly categorizations.
Too many liberals see the world in a very 'compartmentalized' way - actions and their motives belong to specific binary groups and there is no grey area. These compartments are very often based off of current pop-sociology 'research' (= political correctness indoctrination) and the kind of bastardizations of Karl Marx's ideas you would expect to get from a field dominated with people who 'majored in Chicano/Black/LGBT/etc. studies because they're Latino/African American/Gay/etc.' whose expertise amounts to little more than their aptitude for 'identity politics' sloganeering.
This mostly stems from the 'us/other' (false) dichotomy that seems to serve as the cornerstone of most modern sociology studies. For the millions of liberals who have found themselves entranced by this worldview, perhaps after an optional college course or participation in a 'protest', this binary outlook on the world clouds their perception of people's actual motives as they attempt to view everything in these 'academic' terms.
When you add to this the Multiculturalism notions of cultural and moral relativity - we're really all the same, deep down - it is not hard to see why so many liberals often misjudge people's motives by assuming everyone is just like them despite the fact that people are not all the same and motives vary from person to person and values from culture to culture. (Consider: Muslim terrorists murder people because of political/economic/etc. reasons and not for their god. This nonsense gets thrown around repeatedly, even when we as a society are inundated with actual statements from actual terrorists who describe their motives very clearly to be religious in nature.)
Reality is shut out and conformity to theories is all that matters.
Isn't she, like... a racist, or something?
Bingo. I think you understand what is going on, even if you can't put your finger on it.
Consider when I recently asked for evidence that seas would rise to outrageous levels. I was outright attacked. Referred to off-handedly as a 'denier'. Or when I questioned the efficacy of BLM and, despite repeatedly declaring my motives to be understanding the best way to improve the lives of African Americans, was shouted down as a racist.
The sociologist's false dichotomies completely unrelated to reality can only be maintained through great effort of ignorance, denial, and forced conformance. And that last one is very important, because it is PC in a nutshell (consider the historical meaning of the word): Anyone who questions the prevailing political stance, even just to understand it, is against it and immoral; dismissed as a monster, lunatic, or both. I have heard this referred to as something like the 'villainization of dissent'. Hyroglyphx mentions it in his post upthread. But it is really just political correctness taken to the technical levels of the term's meaning.
And this violent dismissal of contrary opinions is not just silly, but it's toxic in terms of maintaining open communication and meaningful discussion. But closing one's mind to the world is the only way to maintain the false worldviews that underpin the majority of the political and academic left's ideologies. Everything they believe is at stake, and that tends to bring out the worst in people.
Now the sad part: I consider myself liberal, and so this behavior really troubles me. It impedes good conversation and exists only to keep people in step with the party line. Worse, it prevents us from solving real problems, helping people, and moving the world forward, which should be the ultimate motives of any good liberal - not the tired attempts to 'spot the bigot' or strip everyone of their unique characteristics to fit them into bad molds.
Or, is she right that political correctness has made liberals completely unable to understand the morality of traditional conservative values?
To an extent, yes, but I think it comes down to this: Instead of trying to fit everything into academic stereotypes like 'class struggles' and 'identity politics' or write everyone off who disagrees with you as immoral and unworthy, folks on the right might be more likely to base their opinions of others on their actions or words, and so are better able to define and understand those actions and words.
Liberals, on the other hand, in trying to fit everything into their false categories, misjudge everyone - including other liberals. This probably comes from the fact that many on the right lack the indoctrination in political leftism that often results from obtaining a four-year college degree in America. They simply don't have as many of the tools that allow liberals to misjudge others and so naturally misjudge people at a lower rate.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Blue Jay, posted 02-24-2016 1:39 PM Blue Jay has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 16 by Blue Jay, posted 02-25-2016 11:23 AM Jon has not replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


(2)
Message 174 of 309 (779297)
03-02-2016 8:09 PM


Stereotypical PC Pathetic Liberal Behavior
For an example of the kind of thing folks have been talking about here, check out this post by Theodoric.
Though Faith asks a perfectly legitimate question in a perfectly academic fashion, Theodoric responds with a typical pathetic Left round of 'spot the bigot' to avoid addressing the question by trying to paint Faith as a bigot for daring to ask it so as to declare himself the winner on some trumped up 'moral superiority' grounds because he would never even think of asking such a thing, the good little Leftist PC soldier he is.
Is this any different than the attitudes in many fundamentalist churches, where even innocent questions are punished merely because they are questions?
This is the kind of horribly destructive and unproductive behavior I was talking about in my posts, and I think others mentioned as well.

Love your enemies!

Replies to this message:
 Message 175 by nwr, posted 03-02-2016 10:22 PM Jon has replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 182 of 309 (779327)
03-03-2016 12:14 PM
Reply to: Message 175 by nwr
03-02-2016 10:22 PM


Re: Stereotypical PC Pathetic Liberal Behavior
You seem to be saying that when a conservative makes a harsh criticism of a liberal, that's just free speech, while when a liberal makes a harsh criticism of a conservative that's PC.
I didn't say any of this. I don't think people should be criticized for asking questions, no matter what the questions.
But the 'declare your opponent a bigot and count yourself a winner without addressing any of the content' is pretty much SOP for Liberal PC behavior.
Conservatives don't typically do this, instead having their own methods for silencing opposition and relieving themselves of the responsibility of offering thoughtful responses. I don't know what you want to call that, but I don't think many would call it Political Correctness.
And I did see several members pile on Theo for this, which gives me some hope for liberalism. He hasn't backed down, though, which gives me little hope for Theo.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 175 by nwr, posted 03-02-2016 10:22 PM nwr has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 185 by nwr, posted 03-03-2016 4:12 PM Jon has replied
 Message 187 by Percy, posted 03-03-2016 4:34 PM Jon has replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 189 of 309 (779361)
03-03-2016 4:55 PM
Reply to: Message 185 by nwr
03-03-2016 4:12 PM


Re: Stereotypical PC Pathetic Liberal Behavior
Many liberals don't do that.
This is an example of you painting with a broad brush.
It's an example of the topic.
You're reading too much into my post and missing that I was just providing an example of the kind of 'PC behavior' we've been talking about.
So I don't stereotype all conservatives based on the bad behavior of the loudmouths.
And that's good of you.
The point is, when Liberals do this, it's called PC. I don't know what it's called when conservatives do it, but conservatives do do it too.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 185 by nwr, posted 03-03-2016 4:12 PM nwr has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 191 by NoNukes, posted 03-03-2016 4:57 PM Jon has replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 190 of 309 (779362)
03-03-2016 4:57 PM
Reply to: Message 187 by Percy
03-03-2016 4:34 PM


Re: Stereotypical PC Pathetic Liberal Behavior
Jon writes:
But the 'declare your opponent a bigot and count yourself a winner without addressing any of the content' is pretty much SOP for Liberal PC behavior.
Conservatives don't typically do this,...
Uh, didn't you just "do this?"
Call someone a 'bigot'?
Not that I'm aware of, no.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 187 by Percy, posted 03-03-2016 4:34 PM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 194 by Percy, posted 03-03-2016 5:45 PM Jon has replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 197 of 309 (779382)
03-03-2016 6:25 PM
Reply to: Message 194 by Percy
03-03-2016 5:45 PM


Re: Stereotypical PC Pathetic Liberal Behavior
didn't you just cast the accusation of "pretty much SOP for Liberal PC behavior...'without addressing any of the content?'"
Why would I address any of the content? This thread isn't the place to discuss gay speech patterns.
I was offering an example of the behavior that has been discussed in this thread.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 194 by Percy, posted 03-03-2016 5:45 PM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 221 by Percy, posted 03-04-2016 7:11 AM Jon has replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 198 of 309 (779383)
03-03-2016 6:33 PM
Reply to: Message 191 by NoNukes
03-03-2016 4:57 PM


Re: Stereotypical PC Pathetic Liberal Behavior
The point is, when Liberals do this, it's called PC. I don't know what it's called when conservatives do it, but conservatives do do it too.
Doesn't this state of affairs seem even the least bit suspicious to you?
Why would it seem suspicious?
We have a term for when Liberals ignore the issues/people/questions and just focus on spotting bigotry, etc.: Political Correctness.
Conservatives engage in similar behaviors but aren't as concerned with spotting bigots; they might be more likely to dismiss someone as a 'socialist' or something like that. But I don't know what it's called when Conservatives do this.
Perhaps we can call it 'kids being kids'.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 191 by NoNukes, posted 03-03-2016 4:57 PM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 199 by Modulous, posted 03-03-2016 6:43 PM Jon has replied
 Message 200 by NoNukes, posted 03-03-2016 8:09 PM Jon has replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 202 of 309 (779391)
03-03-2016 9:59 PM
Reply to: Message 200 by NoNukes
03-03-2016 8:09 PM


Re: Stereotypical PC Pathetic Liberal Behavior
You're a bore, Nukes.
And a dangerous one at that, with your pitiful concepts such as 'unacceptable' speech.
You are just another example of the pathetic political Left.
Edited by Jon, : No reason given.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 200 by NoNukes, posted 03-03-2016 8:09 PM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 208 by NoNukes, posted 03-04-2016 2:23 AM Jon has not replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 203 of 309 (779392)
03-03-2016 10:03 PM
Reply to: Message 199 by Modulous
03-03-2016 6:43 PM


Re: Stereotypical PC Pathetic Liberal Behavior
There really should be a term for people who try to 'correct' someone's political position. No more than that - someone who attempts to bully their opponent into line with the correct political position. A person, who believes themselves to be correct, politically - and insists conformity from others to this, politically correct, position.
Technically true, except I think the overwhelming majority of people associate the P in PC with the politics of the Left, so much so that it would be potentially misleading to use the term to describe Conservative behavior.
ABE: At least this is my observation based on a life surrounded by U.S. politics. Maybe it's different elsewhere.
Edited by Jon, : No reason given.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 199 by Modulous, posted 03-03-2016 6:43 PM Modulous has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 224 by Modulous, posted 03-04-2016 9:49 AM Jon has not replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 239 of 309 (779485)
03-04-2016 5:56 PM
Reply to: Message 221 by Percy
03-04-2016 7:11 AM


Re: Stereotypical PC Pathetic Liberal Behavior
What is the 'content' you want addressed, Percy?
Please be specific.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 221 by Percy, posted 03-04-2016 7:11 AM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 240 by Percy, posted 03-04-2016 8:16 PM Jon has replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 244 of 309 (779514)
03-05-2016 10:08 AM
Reply to: Message 240 by Percy
03-04-2016 8:16 PM


Re: Stereotypical PC Pathetic Liberal Behavior
Please point out where I said this was 'something conservatives don't do'.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 240 by Percy, posted 03-04-2016 8:16 PM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 247 by Percy, posted 03-05-2016 11:09 AM Jon has replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 248 of 309 (779525)
03-05-2016 11:37 AM
Reply to: Message 247 by Percy
03-05-2016 11:09 AM


Re: Stereotypical PC Pathetic Liberal Behavior
I see.
You got to your misunderstanding by taking what I said out of context. Let me put the context back in and help clear up your confusion.
The relevant portion of the message reads:
quote:
Jon in Message 182:
But the 'declare your opponent a bigot and count yourself a winner without addressing any of the content' is pretty much SOP for Liberal PC behavior.
Conservatives don't typically do this, instead having their own methods for silencing opposition and relieving themselves of the responsibility of offering thoughtful responses. I don't know what you want to call that, but I don't think many would call it Political Correctness.
I thought it was pretty obvious that 'do this' was in reference to declaring people bigots, and that I stated unambiguously that I believe conservatives also sidestep addressing the content when I said they have 'their own methods for silencing opposition and relieving themselves of the responsibility of offering thoughtful responses'.
And if this wasn't clear, it should be now.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 247 by Percy, posted 03-05-2016 11:09 AM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 254 by Percy, posted 03-05-2016 1:05 PM Jon has not replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 249 of 309 (779526)
03-05-2016 11:39 AM
Reply to: Message 245 by frako
03-05-2016 10:38 AM


Re: PC punishes whatever doesn't conform to the Acceptable Opinion
erhaps it could be stated more precisely, such as There is a much higher percentage of Muslim violence than Christian violence
But most violent criminals in prison in america are christian, how does that fit in to your logic?
And most terrorist attacks in america in the past 10 years have been comitted by christians.
Most Americans are Christians.
Edited by Jon, : No reason given.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 245 by frako, posted 03-05-2016 10:38 AM frako has not replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 250 of 309 (779527)
03-05-2016 11:43 AM
Reply to: Message 241 by Tangle
03-05-2016 3:01 AM


Re: PC punishes whatever doesn't conform to the Acceptable Opinion
I agree that people often have difficulty separating the ojective fact related content from the value laden assumptions that can lie within them, but that's why we need to be careful with words that we know can be misinterpreted.
People who consistently misinterpret everything they hear should just be ignored.
Nobody should feel obligated to couch everything they say in special terms just so a bunch of nincompoops don't 'take it the wrong way'.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 241 by Tangle, posted 03-05-2016 3:01 AM Tangle has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 251 by ringo, posted 03-05-2016 11:45 AM Jon has replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 252 of 309 (779534)
03-05-2016 12:07 PM
Reply to: Message 251 by ringo
03-05-2016 11:45 AM


Re: PC punishes whatever doesn't conform to the Acceptable Opinion

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 251 by ringo, posted 03-05-2016 11:45 AM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 253 by ringo, posted 03-05-2016 12:13 PM Jon has not replied

  
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