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Author Topic:   Discrimination ok, if based on religion? what else then?
Quetzal
Member (Idle past 5903 days)
Posts: 3228
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 138 of 248 (381067)
01-29-2007 5:48 PM
Reply to: Message 108 by Omnivorous
01-27-2007 1:21 PM


Precedent?
Although I know this is a UK issue, didn't we have a similar kind of case awhile back? Boy Scouts of America vs. Dade? IIRC, the Supreme Court ruled:
quote:
Applying New Jersey’s public accommodations law to require the Boy Scouts to admit Dale violates the Boy Scouts’ First Amendment right of expressive association. Government actions that unconstitutionally burden that right may take many forms, one of which is intrusion into a group’s internal affairs by forcing it to accept a member it does not desire.
Here's the ruling: BSA vs Dade.
I'm pretty sure I disagree with the ruling, but wouldn't the RCC be able to restrict access to services on more-or-less the same grounds? They don't receive state funding, it's a "private" organization (sort of, anyway), etc. I'm not a lawyer, obviously, so I probably don't "get" all the legalities involved. It might be different with service providers, but even restaurants reserve the right to refuse service (although they can't get away with discrimination). Anybody have any idea on this?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 108 by Omnivorous, posted 01-27-2007 1:21 PM Omnivorous has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 140 by Omnivorous, posted 01-29-2007 5:55 PM Quetzal has replied

  
Quetzal
Member (Idle past 5903 days)
Posts: 3228
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 139 of 248 (381068)
01-29-2007 5:51 PM
Reply to: Message 136 by Taz
01-29-2007 2:07 PM


Kind of answers my question.
"And that way there can be no exemptions for faith-based adoption agencies offering public funded services from regulations that prevent discrimination."
Obviously, if the RCC in the UK is receiving public funding, then they bloody well have to follow government rules. Let's not even get in to the propriety of a flipping church receiving state funds...

This message is a reply to:
 Message 136 by Taz, posted 01-29-2007 2:07 PM Taz has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 142 by Taz, posted 01-29-2007 7:35 PM Quetzal has replied

  
Quetzal
Member (Idle past 5903 days)
Posts: 3228
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 141 of 248 (381071)
01-29-2007 5:58 PM
Reply to: Message 140 by Omnivorous
01-29-2007 5:55 PM


Re: Precedent?
That makes sense. It's kind of moot, anyway, since the agencies apparently receive public funds.

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 Message 140 by Omnivorous, posted 01-29-2007 5:55 PM Omnivorous has not replied

  
Quetzal
Member (Idle past 5903 days)
Posts: 3228
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 165 of 248 (381707)
02-01-2007 6:18 PM
Reply to: Message 142 by Taz
01-29-2007 7:35 PM


This is why I highlighted the "public funding" part. The catholic church could stop receiving public fundings and continue with their faith based discrimination and I wouldn't say a single word. I do, however, have a problem with them using public fundings to spread their discrimination.
I'm not so sure about the smoking comment (there IS an actual public health risk, etc - although I'm a smoker... ). However, I am 100% in agreement with the part of your post I quoted above.

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Replies to this message:
 Message 166 by Omnivorous, posted 02-01-2007 6:45 PM Quetzal has replied

  
Quetzal
Member (Idle past 5903 days)
Posts: 3228
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 172 of 248 (381965)
02-02-2007 5:48 PM
Reply to: Message 166 by Omnivorous
02-01-2007 6:45 PM


Law regulates adoption agencies and procedures. While religious organizations have been given (wrongly, IMO) the right to discriminate in hiring against those who don't share their religious beliefs (even when staffing publicly funded activities), it seems to me that allowing them to discriminate against a specific class of persons who seek those services is another matter. Would that not allow some white supremacy church group to accept federal funds to run a soup kitchen and then refuse to serve people of color?
In fact, as I understand it, they wouldn't be able to discriminate for any reason as long as they receive public funds. However, private organizations not receiving tax monies are pretty much free to do as they please. Note well that private entities deemed to provide public services (as you mentioned, I think) also fall under the anti-discrimination laws (restaurants, hotels, transportation services, etc). Again, however, the RCC would seem to have a loophole here - if they are offering private adoption services to church members only - then they can do pretty much whatever they want. They only ran afoul of the law if they supposedly provide services to the general public. This also goes along with your "self-propagation" comment. Or at least, that's how I understand the situation. I have been known to be wrong, on occasion , especially where legal issues are concerned.

This message is a reply to:
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