What gives God the right to be "holy"?

Your post comes across to me as portraying God as a despot, an arbitrary tyrant. God's character and motives are greatly suspicious to your analysis. He is seen as out to limit man from man's best existence, to cramp man in, keep man down, and generally cheat man.This is how your analysis comes across to me.Now I have a problem. How do I know that you are not working for the same evil forces that the serpent in Genesis worked for? Your input is quite reminicient of this deceiving serpent's attack on God's character. " .... Did God really say, You shall not eat of any tree of the garden? ... You shall not surely die. For God knows that in the day you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will become like God knowing good and evil.

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And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food and that it was a delight to the eyes,and that the tree was to be desired to make oneself wise, she took of it and ate ..." (See Gen. 3:3-6)The tone seems very much the same. Question God's word. Then go on to question God's character and God's motives. God is a arbitrary despot and tyrant not loving man or caring for man's best interest.How do I know that your challenges are not simply employments of the same evil anti-God forces ?Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.

I am still a little concerned.You see the tree forbidden was not simply the tree of the knowledge of evil, as in indulgence in alchohol, greedy sex, and debauchery. It was not simply the tree of gambling, stealing, lying, and other obvious bad behaviors.It was the tree of the knowledge of GOOD and evil. Knowledge of Good and evil were on the same tree. In other words even man's philosophy, good deeds, and ethical behavior could also be in rebellion to God.So the temptation is much more subtle than "wine, women, and debauchary".Man could also use lofty philosophy to revolt against God as well.Now I will say one matter about the holiness of God. I think holiness of God is way of saying God is distinct from all other things that exist. Nothing is in the same class as He. He is different from all things, all things.To be fair, the Bible does show that some things dedicated or set aside for His purpose are also discribed as holy - ie, holy angels, holy apostles and prophets.But we have this passage "You alone are holy" (Rev. 15:4).God alone is distinct from all other things which exist. A spiritual beauty and purity His is by His very nature. He alone is holy. For man to become holy God must set man aside for Himself and His purpose, fristly. Then God must infuse man with His element that man is imparted with the life of God and thereby is subjectively made holy. This is by the Holy Spirit.But to the issue, God's authority to pronounce or judge holiness is because this flows out what He Himself is from eternity. Where others cannot partake of His holiness there is no ground for judgment. There is ground for judgment only where there can be rejection and rebellion against God's action to make you holy like Himself.He alone is holy as the source of this characteristic. His Holy Spirit is His reaching man to impart this holiness into man to make man holy.It is not simply that Adam disobeyed a rule. He ate something which got into his being. Something of God's enemy, Satan, entered into man's being at the eating of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.The very good man, the neutral man, move out from a position of neutrality and was saturated with something of the Satanic nature. Man, instead of being made holy from eating the of life, became Satanified by taking a foreign evil element into his being.Eating of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil prohibited him from partaking of the tree of the divine life of God which would have constituted the neutral man holy as God's is holy: "And Jehovah God said, Behold the man has become like one of Us, knowing good and evil; and now, lest he put forth his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat and live forever - ... Therefore Jehovah God snet him forth from the garden of Eden ... So He drove the man out, and at the east of the garden of Eden He placed the cherubim and a flaming sword which turned in every direction to guard the way to the tree of life" ( Gen. 3:22-24)This of course is not the end of the Bible. How God brings man back to the life of God and the holiness of God is the story of salvation. The other books reveal God's actions to overcome every imaginable obstacle to bring man back to Himself. His love is relentless. His wisdom is unsearchable. And His skill to recover man to Himself far transcends anything we could devise.I think I would spend a proportionate amount of time to study what God in His love and faithfulness does to save man and make the redeemed sons of God holy like Himself.

Pointless ?Redemption is to purchase. It is a legal transaction. In this case God purchases back man. God pays a price to purchase man back for Himself.From what does God purchase man? Man has fallen under the law of God. Originally the created man was not in the custody of the law of God. When man became united with the enemy of God he came under the custody of God's law.The Redemption was the purchase of man out from under the righteous law of God. It was the legal price paid to God's law which redeems man back to God. Why is it pointless for God to desire to purchase man back from a curse? "Christ has redeemed us out of the curse of the law, having become a curse on our behalf; because it is written, Cursed is every one hanging on a tree. " (Gal. 3:13a) I don't see this as pointless. For God to seek and recover what He loves which has been lost, pointless? If He didn't care for His creation He could just let us perish under the curse of the law. Man can never fulfill it now that he has become Satanified.If there is no redemption there certainly is no love. If there is no redemption there is no completion of God's eternal purpose in creating man in the first place. Why should God simply give up His eternal purpose for man and leave man lost, to perish under the penalty of His law?Tyranical ?The Savior God was incarnated and came to "serve" man: "And whoever wants to be first among you shall be your slave; Just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve and to give His life as a ransom for many." (Matt. 20:27,28)"For even the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve and to give His life as a ransom for many." (Mark 10:45)This Eternal Person has many facets. He is multifaceted and rich in content, characteristics, and expressions. Why not? He is the uncreated Life which is the Source of all lives.And one aspect of Him is that He came to "serve" us by giving His incarnated life up as a ransom in death on a cross to redeem us. This was a service. And if you are not thankful for it many of us are.You have the wrong enemy. God is King. But He is not the despot or the tyrant. He is the God who became a man and laid down His life to redeem us out from under the curse of the just and righteous law that we became property us when we were joined to the opposition party.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.

You would not know unless you line up what I say with the revelation of God in the Boble. And I suggest strongly that you do that.I want no one just to take my word for it without checking with the word of God.Furthermore, I see no suger and spice and everything nice here. Not everyone is going to accept redemption. They will perish.And this forgiveness is not sugar and spice. It is not a sentimental forgiveness. It is not God saying "Let's just forget about your guilty sins. I know you didn't mean it."No indeed. This redemption is that because one believes in the Son of God justice was imputed on his behalf on the cross. God has not overlooked my sins. I was judged on the cross on Calvary. This is not sugar and spice. The Son of God carried up my sins in His body unto the cross. There the wrath of God caused divine justice to be imputed on Him in my place.Without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness. God forgives but it because judgment has been rendered, justice has been served, the penalty has been enacted on the sinner's behalf. This cost God a tremendous amount which we cannot fully appreciate even unto eternity.Everything was not nice to the Savior Jesus who received the judgment of God for my transgressions, that I might be saved. That's right. I insist that you judge me by fruits. I welcome you to examine what I wrote in the light of the Bible too.One test could be whether what I write. Does it exalt Christ or does it tend to make you want to get along without Him ?I don't claim to be perfected. If you would like to wait until a perfect Christian comes along go ahead. You may have a long wait. Most of us are still a work in progress.But if you would rather receive an answer from a more mature and more perfected Christian you have that right. Me, I took a little from this believer and a little from that believer until I met Jesus for myself. Good verse. Equal time for the doubters. Sure?
You'll find more passages like that in the book of Job.I myself question God in prayer sometimes. I don't think God ever rejects an honest prayer. So by all means, pour out your heart to God in questionings.It is good to go out to a field where you can speak out without fear of disturbing anyone. Then you can pour out your heart to God in questions as in many many Psalms of David.I have found that Christ is the answer to all my questionings. His peace passes all understanding. Just to meet Him and to be in His presence answers about everything. The divine Peace is the answer that deeply puts the heart at rest. I think your point can also be viewed in the story of Jacob wrestling with God. Very good. And I must add that even the Son of God questioned in the hour He bore the sins of the world: "My God, my God, WHY have you forsaken Me?" (Matthew 27:41)This was the ultimate in God questioning the Almighty. Wonderful!
As He carried up my sins in His body to bear the judgment upon them in a horror that we can never know, He cried out as He was forsaken by the Father, that He might redeem me, that He might redeem you.Remember that the Son of God questioned why He had to be forsaken by the Father as He bore your sins that you could be saved.

You may try to boast how your have been there and done that. But your boating rings hollow in the very next post where you speak of Adam and Eve falling from grace?Where did you get that concept of "falling from grace" if not directly from Galatians. But OH NO! you're steering far, far away from that New Testament "drivel". You're gloriously free from the New Testament, Right ?So you're an old pro at twisting ? Very impressive.
Probably no need for me to waste time with your thread.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.

Your "negligent parent" theory doesn't make sense to me.Do you have children of your own ? Do they bitterly rant and rage against you for "negligence" for thier own wrong choices, and those contrary to your clear warning ?You better educate them that what bad concequences they bear for going contrary to your advice is purely the fault of your negligence.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.

Um, Who designed human growth? I mean from zygot to adult, was it your wisdom that designed this growth process? Well, I raised two who are now in their upper 20s and 30s. And I have a house full of four foster kids.Have some kids first and get back with me in a few years.I have little time now. I'll come back and look at your untheology latter. This was a quicky.Genesis doesn't mention eternal damnation. Except it is kind of implied in chapter 3 verse 22, an endless existence in sin.And by definition if God is the source all blessing any place totally free from him where those who want nothing to do with God, must be a hell, I would think.By definition, then, a world "free" from God to the uttermost must be a torment. But you're free to go there is you wish.I think that is really pretty big of God. Especially seeing that His Son already went to damnation on behalf of all that they might not go.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.

Well then, in all human history who would you submit displayed greater moral authority than Jesus Christ ?And I don't see this matter of threat like you do. I am free to jump out the fifth story window of a building. Now once I make that jump I am not necessarily free to decide not to be pulled down to the concrete by the law of gravity. The law of gravity simply will do its thing regardless how I feel about it.We are free to choose. We are not always free to escape the consequences of our choice.Now if someone advises me saying "You know if jump out of the window you will fall down to the ground. You are likely to die."What kind of response is it from me to say "There you go threatening me. You are a tyrant. You are a despot. You just want to threaten me to obey you. You rob me of my freedom, my great potential, my best possibilities."?Isn't this a bit warped? This is warning of the consequences of becoming captive to the laws that are set in this universe.There is a law of sin and death. God warning man of the consequences of such a law of sin and death is not His threatening of man. It is His care for man. We are free to choose. We may not always be free to change the consequences of our choices.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.Edited by jaywill, : No reason given.