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Author Topic:   Radical Clerics, Christian Morals, and Homosexuality
Straggler
Member (Idle past 95 days)
Posts: 10333
From: London England
Joined: 09-30-2006


(1)
Message 120 of 153 (697529)
04-26-2013 7:15 PM
Reply to: Message 119 by Phat
04-26-2013 3:02 PM


Re: Reasons and Bigotry
Phat writes:
All I can say is that I believe in One Holy Spirit. We are all not it...at best we are either in communion with it or in rebellion against it.
Why can one not be apathetically disinclined...?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 119 by Phat, posted 04-26-2013 3:02 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 121 by Rahvin, posted 04-26-2013 7:30 PM Straggler has not replied
 Message 127 by Phat, posted 04-29-2013 8:21 AM Straggler has replied

  
Straggler
Member (Idle past 95 days)
Posts: 10333
From: London England
Joined: 09-30-2006


(2)
Message 130 of 153 (697716)
04-29-2013 8:54 AM
Reply to: Message 127 by Phat
04-29-2013 8:21 AM


Re: Reasons and Bigotry
I suppose the bottom line here is that whilst you are free to believe whatever you damn well please it is quite another thing to in anyway impose such subjective beliefs on others.
Wiith regard to homosexuality specifically it seems in very large part a matter of interpretation and priority as to whether even the most devout Christian should have any more against homosexuality than the eating of prawns or working on the Sabbath and suchlike...
The fact is some people just cannot stop worrying about what other people do with their genitals in a way that is considerably more fanatical than their concern as to whether other people are eating shellfish. I don't wholly understand why.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 127 by Phat, posted 04-29-2013 8:21 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 133 by Phat, posted 04-30-2013 5:10 AM Straggler has replied
 Message 137 by Phat, posted 04-30-2013 9:06 AM Straggler has replied

  
Straggler
Member (Idle past 95 days)
Posts: 10333
From: London England
Joined: 09-30-2006


Message 135 of 153 (697788)
04-30-2013 8:03 AM
Reply to: Message 133 by Phat
04-30-2013 5:10 AM


Re: Reasons and Bigotry
Phat quotes writes:
For example, what if someone asserted that it is an unalienable human right for a man to marry all the objects of his love:
Does the term "consenting adults" mean nothing to you....?
Phat writes:
At the time I read the article, I indeed agreed that it was absurd to equate loving another human in the same vein of loving a car.
People do some strange things with inanimate objects. And nothing you say or do is likely to change that. But if we are talking marriage specifically - Then it's a legal requirement that both parties consent is it not?
Can a car consent to marriage?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 133 by Phat, posted 04-30-2013 5:10 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 136 by Phat, posted 04-30-2013 8:56 AM Straggler has replied

  
Straggler
Member (Idle past 95 days)
Posts: 10333
From: London England
Joined: 09-30-2006


(1)
Message 148 of 153 (697898)
05-01-2013 2:18 PM
Reply to: Message 137 by Phat
04-30-2013 9:06 AM


Re: Reasons and Bigotry
Phat writes:
Does not the church...within its own doors...have a right to encourage conformity among its members without being hated upon by society for suggesting conformity?
Do not consenting adults..within their own doors..have a right to engage in physical acts with each other without the church concerning itself with who is doing what to who?
Phat writes:
Does not the church...within its own doors...have a right to encourage conformity....
Only if it accepts that when these "encouragements" are taken outside it's doors the things being objected to can similarly be undertaken outside of closed doors...
So the next time you see someone preaching that "God hates fags" or whatever you are duty bound to start engaging in anal and oral sex in front of them.
Or we could just keep both preaching conformity and the practices themselves behind closed doors.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 137 by Phat, posted 04-30-2013 9:06 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Straggler
Member (Idle past 95 days)
Posts: 10333
From: London England
Joined: 09-30-2006


(1)
Message 149 of 153 (697902)
05-01-2013 2:33 PM
Reply to: Message 136 by Phat
04-30-2013 8:56 AM


Re: Reasons and Bigotry
Phat writes:
The point is the behavior.
Then why did you ask me about marriage?
Phat writes:
Perhaps the question should be framed as this: Should society have a right to suggest appropriate behavior?
Society will inevitably do exactly that. The question is how individual rights and societal consensus are balanced.
Phat writes:
Would I be bigoted if I informed an amorous car lover that their behavior was harmful?
Harmful to whom?
If it were demonstrably harmful and you had the facts on your side it wouldn't be bigoted to present the facts. But what the person in question does with those facts is largely up to them. If you start selecting facts to push an agenda then it may well qualify as bigotry on your part.
Phat writes:
What do we tell our children about human behavior and why do we tell them what we tell/teach them?
Well the actualities of human behaviour might be worth considering - No?
Phat writes:
This goes so far as to include heterosexual behavior as well.
Heterosexuals can get up some pretty unbiblical shit dude. If you gonna preach "conformity" you gonna have your work cut out with the heteros before you even need to consider anyone else.
Blessed are those who do not urinate in each others nostrils....etc.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 136 by Phat, posted 04-30-2013 8:56 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
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