Political Identity Crisis

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Now, overweight people are victims of the religious and extreme right, eh? Those Repukies just stuffing food down everyone's throat; denying them the right to walk around and exercise and such....you know it's true cuz crash seys so.

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Who runs/and supports the auto/petroleum industries, which have turned this country into a population of drivers insead of walkers or bikers? That's right; Republicans!As a consequence, most of our city and town planning for the last 60 years is designed around suburban neighborhoods where you have to have automobiles instead of town centers where businesses and residential areas are mixed so you actually can walk to the market.Who gives tax breaks to large corporations like Wal-Mart, General Mills, Con-Agra, Pilsbury, and all of the other companies which produce and promote and sell high-calorie, high fat, high sugar, high sodium, highly processed, full-of-preservatives, low nutrient convenience foods?Why do we need convenience foods? Because middle class american families need both parents, and in many cases, the teenaged kids, to work to make ends meet these days, let alone be able to afford to send the kids to college. Real wages for the middle and lower classes have stagnated or dropped in the last 5-8 years, while the cost of living has gone up and up.Record profits this year for oil industry executives, though, and the richest Americans saw their wealth increase by over 50%!So, because both parents need to work to pay the bills, there is less time for people to prepare healthy meals, so they just swing through the drive through or call for pizza, or make some Hamburger Helper.

Reagan and Bush Sr. were liberals?

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That said, they hardly eat better quality food. The food in Europe is essentially the same thing, if not worse.

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Actually, that's not really true. There is a great deal greater availability of unprocessed, "real" food in France, Italy, Spain, Portugal, Belgium, and Swizerland, for example, compared to what is available in the US.You can buy Prosciutto di Parma at highway rest stops in Italy, find artisan cheeses in every French town, and the snackbar in the Shell stations on the highways in Portugal have a barista pulling shots and you can buy a handmade sandwich or pastry.There have always been great traditions of going to the market every day, many of the most important traditions in those countries are foods, and they are revered by the people and protected by the government. And it's also considered normal for people to actually cook.

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You have much fewer options for "health" food as you do in the US, and much of it is fried just the same as in the US.

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Just because food is fried doesn't mean it's unhealthy.Vegetable, olive oil, and whole grain consumption is much higher in Europe compared the the US, especially in Mediterranean countries.What Americans eat a lot of compared to Europeans, and is unhealthy, is highly processed, calorie-dense and nutrient-poor convenience foods.

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In fact, my own experiences are that they generally eat "junk" food more often. Candy, grease, smoke, and alcohol are ever present.

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But, since they eat more good stuff, especially red wine, they have more protection. Candy and grease are not inherently harmful. The French in particular are very adamant about not having chemicals or artificial things in their food.I've also read some interesting studies in which it was claimed, with some support, that Americans also have more stress, guilt, and anxiety about food; while the French view food as a pleasure to be enjoyed, Americans view food as something that will potentially make you ill. The old view of something that is too pleasurable being "sinful".As we know, constant generalized anxiety is more and more considered to be a major contributing factor to disease.This message has been edited by schrafinator, 01-28-2006 01:15 PM

Yeah, I know.

Jesus, why would you drink soda when you are in France?

this place is really, really funny.If the rest of the people here weren't paranoid, crazy, creepy, or had sticks up their butts, it would be a lit like my workplace.

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I'm not sure if people are eating as much of the unprocessed foods, despite their availability, in such great numbers that it would make a difference statistically.

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This is interesting to me. Do you have any documentation or support for this to send me to so I can read more? It is my understanding that while highly processed convenience foods are becoming more available in Europe, it is still the norm for people to mostly eat "real food".

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While local grocer shopping may have been popular in the past, chain food stores are essentially the norm now, with local grocers being more like convenience stores.

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Well, I didn't see any chain grocery stores in Porto, Lisbon, or any of the smaller cities we visited in Portugal when I was there a few years ago. I was in several major cities and also small villages in France, Italy, Germany, Switzerland, Spain, and Great Britain about 15 years ago, and the only place that had prominent chain grocery stores was England.Maybe things have radically changed in Europe in the past 15 years, because that's certainly enough time for such change to happen, but I am doubtful.

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Cheeses are definitely better, and one can get what appears to be fresher fruit in open air markets.

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I am of course not married to this, and am open to any evidence. I freely admit my experiences may be skewed by living in urban areas (in the US) where health food stores abound as a trend.

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Sure.

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But I will tell you one thing, you sure as hell can get fresh fish all over the place, especially in the benelux/scandinavian areas. Frankly I don't see how people don't die of food poisoning from eating fish as "fresh" and raw as they do.

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Are you saying that people eat raw fish that is not fresh, as in they eat spoiled raw fish? I am a little confused by your statement, sorry.

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I believe you've told me this before, and I forget exactly how this works. What is the most healthy oil(s) to cook in?

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There are many healthful oils for cooking, and olive oil is one of the best. Apparently (unhydrogenated) palm oil is good for you too. But basically you want to stick with monounsaturates for the most part, although some saturated fats like mammal body fat (like bacon fat) and butter occasionally are not that big of a deal in the diet. It's the hydrogenated "tinkered-with" fats that seem to be the really unhealthy ones. So, stick with "real" food, basically.

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And then what is the difference between commonly used oils in europe v us? When I worked food service years ago we always used vegetable oil for cooking. I can't remember which kind though.

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They use a lot of olive oil in the mediterranian. A lot. They also cook with lard now and then, especially in Germany and in parts of France, and everybody has traditional dishes which use rendered the fat from some kind of cured pork product. Grapeseed oil is commonly used, especially in France, when they want a neutral oil.In the US, people commonly use shortening, margarine, and plain vegetable oil (usually soybean), and also corn oil, so your experience is typical. Peanut oil is cheap so restaurants like using it, but with all the problems with peanut alergies, many have stopped.When I'm at work it's fairly common for guests to ask if a particular olive oil they like comes in a smaller bottle (smaller than 500ml), because they think it's too much for them to go through. I then ask them if they think they will use it up in a year (because that's how long it will keep), and they say that no, they didn't think so. Contrast this with the following story...Our CEO tells a story of a conversation he had with an older Italian couple as they all were in attendance during the milling and pressing of the olive oil at their local frantoio. He asked them how much olive oil they went through in a year, and they said that they didn't cook as much as they used to, because the children were all grown and moved away, so they consumed a mere 100 liters a year or so.

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It amused me to find that people here have home deep friers like it is the most common thing to have a miniature one of those tubs you see at McDs in your own kitchen.

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Properly deep-fried food has no more fat than food sauteed in a skillet, actually, and in some cases has less. If the temperature is correct (not too low) then the coating doesn't absorb much oil. This one surprised me when I learned it a couple of years ago.One of these days, I'm going to buy myself one of those home deep fryers. So much more economical and than using a big pot, and you don't have to keep fiddling with the heat to keep the temp steady as they have their own thermostat.

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Actually I was wondering about that. Do you know if port offers the same protections? Especially tawny or ruby port?

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Ahh, port. I have a little bit left of a wonderful LBV and a 30 year old tawny I brought back from Portugal. I would imagine that the ruby would have the benefit, because it's the antioxidants, specifically one called resveratol and another called saponin, in the red grape skins that confer the goodies to the wine. A glass or two a day is good.

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I guess that's what I was trying to go for anyway. Regardless of what they eat, they seem to have less stress about life in general as they live it in a different way... less "sinful" feelings, including guilt about doing nothing and just relaxing. And yeah, not so much guilt when they glob the mayo on a big sack of frites. That's what they want damnit!

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I also think there's a lot of "rebellion" eating in the US. Like, you said, "That's what they want damnit!", except that in Europe, there isn't that self-judging thing about enjoying "bad for you" food. They don't have to justify anything to themselves. It's just not part of the thinking process surrounding food. Also, since they are generally raised on much more high-quality food and home cooking, their palates and tastes are much more homed to good flavor.Here, people try to "eat right" and then binge on junk when they can't take the boring eating anymore. The reason "eating right" is so boring, is because Americans are so divorced from the kitchen that they don't know how to prepare simple dishes from fresh ingredients, and therefore resort to frozen meals and health food store stuff, which is at times underseasoned and blah.I think people are cooking more in America, though, and are using better ingredients. The popularity of people like Emeril and Rachel Ray are great for helping people get back into the kitchen, and you can find some pretty good stuff in regular grocery stores now that you couldn't just a few years ago. Farmer's markets are becoming really popular, tooBut we have a long way to go, that's for sure.

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I don't understand this. What difference does it make what we eat?

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I just eat whatever's available.

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We must eat to stay alive, and we also can choose in the US among a staggering aray of foodstuffs in an equally-staggering range of quality levels.What we eat has a direct impact upon our health both long and short term, mood, and quality of life.

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What I eat affects my mood? Like if I eat hotdogs, I'll be in a bad mood, but if I eat fresh fish I won't be?

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Maybe.Tryptohan, which is present in foods like turkey, beans, and fish, is a precursor to seratonin, a mood-enhancing chemical. There are also several particular nutrients which are present in carbohydrates which increase the creation of seratonin from tryptophan.Chocolate also contains some mood-lifting chemicals.Spikes in blood sugar levels definitely affect mood and energy and thinking ability in a big way, as does caffeine and it's withdrawl sysmproms. So, foods that have a lot of refined carbohydrates tend to give you a big boost in energy quickly, but then crash you down later.