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Author Topic:   Evolution. We Have The Fossils. We Win.
ringo
Member (Idle past 443 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2299 of 2887 (831922)
04-27-2018 12:42 PM
Reply to: Message 2298 by Faith
04-27-2018 12:31 PM


Re: Faith indulges in fantasy again
Faith writes:
...they look to me like they were formed by swirling water.
Then it should be possible to reproduce them experimentally.

An honest discussion is more of a peer review than a pep rally. My toughest critics here are the people who agree with me. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2298 by Faith, posted 04-27-2018 12:31 PM Faith has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 443 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2602 of 2887 (832333)
05-02-2018 3:16 PM
Reply to: Message 2598 by Faith
05-02-2018 3:00 PM


Re: Some points I felt like answering
Faith writes:
Yes I believe a trilobite is a trilobite and that they had prodigious genetic diversity, different eyes and the works, one genome, lots of variability.
That's consistent with your belief in a "super-genome" that became differentiated only after the Flood.
So why didn't the trilobites survive the Flood?

An honest discussion is more of a peer review than a pep rally. My toughest critics here are the people who agree with me. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2598 by Faith, posted 05-02-2018 3:00 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2623 by Faith, posted 05-02-2018 9:12 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 443 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(1)
Message 2651 of 2887 (832403)
05-03-2018 11:36 AM
Reply to: Message 2623 by Faith
05-02-2018 9:12 PM


Re: no supergenome
Faith writes:
I now explain the great genetic diversity before the Flood and therefore in the saved creatures on the ark, as due to the much less junk DNA, probably almost none, and therefore a lot more functioning genes.
That's pretty much the same thing. Both ideas rely on something changing magically after the flood.
But the question remains: Why didn't the trilobites survive the Flood?

An honest discussion is more of a peer review than a pep rally. My toughest critics here are the people who agree with me. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2623 by Faith, posted 05-02-2018 9:12 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2653 by Faith, posted 05-03-2018 11:49 AM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 443 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2652 of 2887 (832404)
05-03-2018 11:43 AM
Reply to: Message 2644 by Faith
05-03-2018 9:17 AM


Re: Ancient beaches and seas, no
Faith writes:
I don't need to convince diehard evolutionists in order to know if I've done a good job or not.
Like Trump, everything you do is the best that has ever been done, even when it's an abject failure. Reality be damned. And not only are you an amazing success but you also know who to blame for your failure.

An honest discussion is more of a peer review than a pep rally. My toughest critics here are the people who agree with me. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2644 by Faith, posted 05-03-2018 9:17 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2654 by Faith, posted 05-03-2018 11:51 AM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 443 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2655 of 2887 (832408)
05-03-2018 11:54 AM
Reply to: Message 2653 by Faith
05-03-2018 11:49 AM


Re: no supergenome
Faith writes:
Nothing changed genetically after the Flood, what are you talking about?
In Message 2623 you said:
quote:
I now explain the great genetic diversity before the Flood and therefore in the saved creatures on the ark, as due to the much less junk DNA, probably almost none, and therefore a lot more functioning genes.
So less junk DNA then, more junk DNA now. More functioning genes then, less functioning genes now. How is that not a change?
And why didn't the trilobites survive the Flood?

An honest discussion is more of a peer review than a pep rally. My toughest critics here are the people who agree with me. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2653 by Faith, posted 05-03-2018 11:49 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2710 by Faith, posted 05-04-2018 6:14 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 443 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2656 of 2887 (832409)
05-03-2018 11:56 AM
Reply to: Message 2654 by Faith
05-03-2018 11:51 AM


Re: Ancient beaches and seas, no
Faith writes:
But I also know I've done a basically good job of putting together the arguments for the Flood.
Then you have very low standards.

An honest discussion is more of a peer review than a pep rally. My toughest critics here are the people who agree with me. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2654 by Faith, posted 05-03-2018 11:51 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2659 by Faith, posted 05-03-2018 11:57 AM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 443 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2661 of 2887 (832414)
05-03-2018 12:01 PM
Reply to: Message 2659 by Faith
05-03-2018 11:57 AM


Re: Ancient beaches and seas, no
Faith writes:
... maybe I'm just up against a hidebound bunch of anti-dreationists.
You're up against the evidence. And you're also up against the Bible.

An honest discussion is more of a peer review than a pep rally. My toughest critics here are the people who agree with me. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2659 by Faith, posted 05-03-2018 11:57 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2663 by Faith, posted 05-03-2018 12:06 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 443 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2666 of 2887 (832421)
05-03-2018 12:10 PM
Reply to: Message 2663 by Faith
05-03-2018 12:06 PM


Re: Ancient beaches and seas, no
Faith writes:
Disagree on both counts.
And you're wrong on both counts. Mountains of evidence (literally) disproves your Flood and you can't explain any of it. And the Bible doesn't support your fantasy of repeated waves, volcanoes, etc. It's all in your head.

An honest discussion is more of a peer review than a pep rally. My toughest critics here are the people who agree with me. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2663 by Faith, posted 05-03-2018 12:06 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2668 by Faith, posted 05-03-2018 12:13 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 443 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2670 of 2887 (832426)
05-03-2018 12:20 PM
Reply to: Message 2668 by Faith
05-03-2018 12:13 PM


Re: Ancient beaches and seas, no
Faith writes:
Keep up the silly one liners, ringo, I can answer you one for one.
But you can't. You always run away from discussions of the Bible (as well you should because you wouldn't recognise the Bible if it sat down beside you in church).
And you've proven in almost every post that you have no explanation for the evidence.

An honest discussion is more of a peer review than a pep rally. My toughest critics here are the people who agree with me. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2668 by Faith, posted 05-03-2018 12:13 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2675 by Faith, posted 05-03-2018 3:38 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 443 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2702 of 2887 (832477)
05-04-2018 11:38 AM
Reply to: Message 2675 by Faith
05-03-2018 3:38 PM


Re: Ancient beaches and seas, no
Faith writes:
I'm the only one here with the correct understanding of the Bible....
And yet you don't have the courage to stand up for what you think you know. By all means, let's discuss what the Bible says.

An honest discussion is more of a peer review than a pep rally. My toughest critics here are the people who agree with me. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2675 by Faith, posted 05-03-2018 3:38 PM Faith has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 443 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2759 of 2887 (832561)
05-05-2018 11:44 AM
Reply to: Message 2710 by Faith
05-04-2018 6:14 PM


Re: no supergenome
Faith writes:
Yes that is a change, but it's a normal change due to microevolution, which would produce junk DNA over many generations.
But you don't have near enough generations for a generic "cat kind" to differentiate into so many different species. (And bear in mind that we have descriptions of cats exactly like modern cats going back about as far as the supposed Flood.)
Faith writes:
I've wondered myself why all the trilobites died out. But I did see somewhere that there is a land-adapted species of trilobite living today.
There are a lot of species that superficially resemble trilobites but they're not trilobites.

An honest discussion is more of a peer review than a pep rally. My toughest critics here are the people who agree with me. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2710 by Faith, posted 05-04-2018 6:14 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2761 by Faith, posted 05-05-2018 12:21 PM ringo has replied
 Message 2762 by Faith, posted 05-05-2018 12:27 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 443 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2763 of 2887 (832566)
05-05-2018 12:34 PM
Reply to: Message 2761 by Faith
05-05-2018 12:21 PM


Re: no supergenome
Faith writes:
Cats don't vary as much as some other animals.
Exactly. If cats couldn't differentiate that much, how could other "kinds" with more variation?
Faith writes:
But anyway there is certainly plenty of time for the creation of many different species of anything to have formed since the ark.
Based on what?
Faith writes:
4500 years is plenty of time to establish many such separated populations in different parts of the world, all splitting off from the original ark population and becoming reproductively isolated from all the other populations.
And yet we know that the Egyptians had cats just like ours 4000 years ago. They also had lions more than 3000 years ago. Lions were also mentioned in the Bible more than 2000 years ago. Your time line is actually much less than 4500 years.
Faith writes:
Human beings probably only need a few hundred years in an isolated location to develop a characteristic racial appearance. I don't know how long, but only as long as it would take for the whole population to merge all their genes together through enough generations of marrying each other.
Merging races is the opposite of differentiating into races.

An honest discussion is more of a peer review than a pep rally. My toughest critics here are the people who agree with me. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2761 by Faith, posted 05-05-2018 12:21 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2765 by Faith, posted 05-05-2018 12:47 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 443 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2764 of 2887 (832567)
05-05-2018 12:36 PM
Reply to: Message 2762 by Faith
05-05-2018 12:27 PM


Re: no supergenome
Faith writes:
ringo writes:
There are a lot of species that superficially resemble trilobites but they're not trilobites.
Maybe.
So why didn't the trilobites survive the flood? The purpose of the ark was to preserve life. Why didn't it work?
ABE:
Faith writes:
I think there are certain characteristics that identify a trilobite no matter how superficially it may seem to differ from others.
You're stating it backwards: There are certain characteristics that identify a trilobite no matter how superficially it may resemble the others.
Edited by ringo, : Responding to Faith's edit.

An honest discussion is more of a peer review than a pep rally. My toughest critics here are the people who agree with me. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2762 by Faith, posted 05-05-2018 12:27 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2767 by Faith, posted 05-05-2018 12:49 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 443 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2768 of 2887 (832572)
05-05-2018 12:55 PM
Reply to: Message 2765 by Faith
05-05-2018 12:47 PM


Re: no supergenome
Faith writes:
Cats seem to vary a lot less than other kinds.
As I pointed out, they haven't changed at all in 4000 years.

An honest discussion is more of a peer review than a pep rally. My toughest critics here are the people who agree with me. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2765 by Faith, posted 05-05-2018 12:47 PM Faith has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 443 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2771 of 2887 (832575)
05-05-2018 1:02 PM
Reply to: Message 2767 by Faith
05-05-2018 12:49 PM


Re: no supergenome
Faith writes:
The ark's purpose was to preserve land creatures; sea creatures had to fend for themselves.
That makes no sense. Why would God have such a stupid plan?
It isn't true either. God told Noah to take "every living thing of all flesh", clean and unclean (I'm assuming that trilobites were unclean).

An honest discussion is more of a peer review than a pep rally. My toughest critics here are the people who agree with me. -- ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2767 by Faith, posted 05-05-2018 12:49 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2772 by Faith, posted 05-05-2018 1:17 PM ringo has replied

  
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