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Author
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Topic: GENESIS 22:17 / NOT A PROMISE GIVEN TO THE JEWS
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jar
Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Asiatic first, African second. and since when are Celts a major population group. ROTHFLMAO
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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How did the Lost Tribes get across the Sambatyon?
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Message 39 of 337 (131471)
08-07-2004 11:26 PM
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Reply to: Message 38 by Amlodhi
08-07-2004 11:12 PM
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Thank you for presenting some of the bases for doctor Scott's theory. Od course you realize this old theory is not really from Gene Scott, rather just one he's revived. One of the early pushers of this idea was Herbert W. Armstrong, founder of the self-proclaimed "Worldwide Church of God." Like Gene Scott he was mostly a promoter, had his own paid television show and wrote and pushed books and lectures on the subject.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 38 by Amlodhi, posted 08-07-2004 11:12 PM | | Amlodhi has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 41 by Amlodhi, posted 08-08-2004 9:41 AM | | jar has replied |
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jar
Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Message 43 of 337 (131610)
08-08-2004 1:26 PM
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Reply to: Message 41 by Amlodhi
08-08-2004 9:41 AM
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Speaking of the Lost Tribes, do you believe there is any hope of expanding the Cohanim experiment to include other of the tribes? In addition, has any Cohanim studies been used within the European Populations?
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 41 by Amlodhi, posted 08-08-2004 9:41 AM | | Amlodhi has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 44 by Amlodhi, posted 08-08-2004 4:07 PM | | jar has replied |
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jar
Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Message 45 of 337 (131674)
08-08-2004 4:19 PM
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Reply to: Message 44 by Amlodhi
08-08-2004 4:07 PM
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I think it is fascinating stuff and unlike the Brit-Am story, one that is actually done scientificly and well documanted.
Here's a link to the PBS tanscript of some of the program. At least in this one case, we certainly know that at least one of the Lost Tribes migrated first to Yemen and then further south to Southern Africa.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 44 by Amlodhi, posted 08-08-2004 4:07 PM | | Amlodhi has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 46 by Amlodhi, posted 08-08-2004 8:43 PM | | jar has replied |
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jar
Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Message 47 of 337 (131726)
08-08-2004 10:46 PM
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Reply to: Message 46 by Amlodhi
08-08-2004 8:43 PM
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The really important part of this is that it is very unlikely that any of the Lost Tribes went anywhere without a priest. This means that by identifying the Cohens, anywhere in the world, and then using a combination of DNA and geneology, it should be possible to trace the movements and migrations and to determine when they enter the general population. It should be relatively easy to test for the Cohanim connection in the general population that has been asserted to be part of the Lost Tribes. The marker should be there even if the actual religion named at the time was Druid.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 46 by Amlodhi, posted 08-08-2004 8:43 PM | | Amlodhi has not replied |
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jar
Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: Red Hand of Zarah
Actually, that is simply Hand Dexter. The color of the hand simply matched other colors. The significance was whether it was Dexter or Sinister.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: Red Hand of Zarah
British/Brutus Brit: covenant ish: man British: O.T. covenant man. Also, that is simply a mistaken etymology of the term British.
British - O.E. Bryttisc "of or relating to ancient Britons," from Bryttas "natives of ancient Britain" (see Briton). First record of British Isles is from 1621.
Briton - Anglo-Fr. Bretun, from L. Brittonem (nom. Britto, misspelled Brito in MSS) "a member of the tribe of the Britons," from *Britt-os, the Celtic name of the Celtic inhabitants of Britain and southern Scotland before the 5c. Anglo-Saxon invasion drove them into Wales, Cornwall, and a few other corners. Only in historical use after O.E. period; revived when James I was proclaimed King of Great Britain in 1604, and made official at the union of England and Scotland in 1707. Also, the people that were the actual Brittons are few in number and certainly not the later Anglo-Saxons.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: Red Hand of Zarah
Okay, Cliff For eytomology, try Eytomology on line Now, for a short history of Brittian, do you have any idea when the Saxons entered the Island? Are you familiar with the Saxon religions at all? Do you know that Brittons were actually not on the Island? And when you're ready, I'll be glad to discuss heraldry with you. (one of my pet hobbies) How much do you know about the Roman occupation of the Island?
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: Red Hand of Zarah
Okay, the red hand that you showed is simply Hand Gules Dexter. That means it's a red right hand open. It is very common and has nothing to do with religion. The etymology of the term British is exactly as I showed. It is latin in form and has nothing to do with covenent or man.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: Red Hand of Zarah
This comment asserts something unknown to be fact. IOW, you have subjectively decided secular history versions to be settled fact.
Secular history sources are not in the business of proving the Bible correct whether intentional or not.
Where do you think the genius of Britain and its empire felt worldwide originates from ?
The BEST evidence of the general claims/facts of Dr. Scott's research being true is the secular world at large and their EVIL dismissal of this subject as racism of a cult.
You are a supremely intelligent person with vast knowledge AND YOU DIDN'T KNOW THIS = proof of Satan's ability to control the world = well known Bible claim.
This means the Hyksos/Shepard King expulsion happened about c.1550 BC
(source Dr.Gene Scott)
The title of my topic has been proven from scripture. This subject is too hard to stay narrowly focused. I rest my case. Bullshit. Just like the "Proof of God" and "What God thinks of Fundamentalists" threads.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Let's return to the Red Hand.
WILLOWTREE, I believe that you might be making a major error in assuming that the emblem shown is indicative of the "Red Hand of Zarah". First, you are basing this on the passage from Genesis 38:28-30.
28: And it came to pass, when she travailed, that the one put out his hand: and the midwife took and bound upon his hand a scarlet thread, saying, This came out first,
29: And it came to pass, as he drew back his hand, that, behold, his brother came out: and she said, How hast thou broken forth? this breach be upon thee: therefore his name was called Pharez.
30: And afterward came out his brother, that had the scarlet thread upon his hand: and his name was called Zarah. As can be clearly seen, a red thread was tied on the childs hand to identify which child was to be considered first born. A red thread. In Heraldry that would be shown as just that, a hand bound by a thread, not as a solid red hand. The symbol for a cord or rope was quite common in heraldry and often used to show connection between two different houses or distaff members of a family. In addition, there was only a limited number of colors and very great variety between shade and hue for the same color. For example, white and silver were refered to by the same name as were yellow and gold. Shades varied across the spectrum. The colors could be simply decorative or if associated with an object, carry some meaning. For example, Gules when associated with a wepon, defensive fortification, animal or physical body part could symbolize Warrior, Martyr, Military Strength. But when it comes to a hand, if is is not mailed it has the martyr meaning as opposed to martial. The made up coat of arms that you used as an illustration also shows the Heraldric Crusaders Cross. This brings in a major conflict as you have a symbol for having taken part in a crusade as well as being martyred. Since the Crusades cannot date before 1095 AD, any connection with the arrival of people in 700BCE or earlier is ridiculous. So the example shown is inaccurate on the grounds of date, symbolism, lack of binding thread, use of whole hand instead of the binding thread and meaning of the color red. Finally, I have been unable to find any referance to "The Red Hand of Zarah" as a symbol in any of my sources for heraldric interpretation or on any heraldric web sites. The only such cites are in sites propounding the same theory you are pushing.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Some more information on the specific red hand
as included in the families surrounding the Ulster area. Here is one quote on the severed red right hand as seen in the Ulster area.
There are some symbols that have a specific significance in Irish Heraldry . . . The severed red right hand (dexter hand couped at the wrist gules) is a feature of many coats of arms for families of the U Neill (i.e. descendants of Niall). This same symbol is associated with the province of Ulster and appears on the Arms of that province and on the modern flag of Northern Ireland. There are at least three explanations of its origins. The first relates to the name of the son of Bolg or Nuadu, the Sun God of the Celts, and by some accounts the divine progenitor of all Celts. This son was known as Labraid Lmhdhearg (Labraid of the Red Hand). The association of the symbolic red hand with the Sun God, therefore makes it an appropriate heraldic icon. The second relates to Nuada, king of the Tuatha D Danann, who had his right hand severed by Sreng during a great battle with the Fomorians. No imperfect man being allowed to hold the throne, Nuada was forced to abdicate in favour of Bres. However, a silver hand was fashioned for him and the power of ancient magic was used to cause flesh and sinew to grow back around the prosthesis. When Bres died, Nuada again assumed his royal place. The third explanation is somewhat more fanciful. The story tells of a pact among the seven sons of Miledh of Esbain, the Celtic king who sons conquered Ireland that the ruler of the new land would be whosoever among them first touched the soil of the island. As the flotilla approached the shore, one of the sons took his sword, cut off his right hand and threw it to land, thus becoming the ruler. He must have been either left handed or pretty stupid (or both) otherwise it is unlikely that he could have thrown the severed hand well enough to accomplish his purpose. Certainly, he was left handed for the rest of his life. The story, if true, may relate to Erimhon who is reputed to have been the first Celtic ruler of the northern part of Ireland. His brother Ebher ruled the southern half. They were the only two of the seven brothers who survived the conquest. More information available here
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Re: Let's return to the Red Hand.
So you do not despute all of the evidence I provided pertaining to the origin, meaning and symbolism of the Red Hand, the obvious descrepance between the Biblical account and the Coat of Arms and the clear evidence that the Red Hand has entirely different interpretations than your sources?
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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jar
Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: 04-20-2004
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Well, let's try a summary. IIRC, the issues are: 1) Origin of the word British: status at least two different possibilities have been shown. 2) Origin of the Celts or Anglo-Saxons: status Genetics seems to show no connection with the semetic or asiatic peoples, NO connection with Hebrews. 3) Meaning of the red hand on coats of arms: status It has been shown that the red hand is not reflected by the Biblical Quotes. In addition, at least three other explainations for the use of the red hand have been shown. So it certainly appears that the OP is at best, unproved.
Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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