Group of atheists has filed a lawsuit

But even you don't believe it passes the test.Look, we've been asking you for many many posts to explain how this object was any aid to anyone at Ground Zero APART from it being similar looking to a Christian artifact.You've failed to answer.That means you know, as well as we do, that the ONLY reason that THIS girder is more important than any of the 10,000 other girders they had to haul away, is because this one looks like a cross.That's religious. Solely religious. Completely religious. And more specifically, one particular religion over another.Further, the implication of these religious beliefs is that Jesus knew this was going to happen and ALLOWED it to happen. I guess to inspire us to kill Muslims.As such this girder isn't just an artifact which gave comfort, but is, thanks to the Christians claims, a validation of our holy war.Putting it in the museum is thumbing your nose at every other religious faith on the planet.

I think the implication of admitting that is admitting the Jesus was either responsible for, or at the very least complacent in, the attacks.If he had the power to put the cross in the building during construction in anticipation, or awareness to change existing materials during the attack, then surely he could have warned someone to try and stop it.

You are arguing context, specifics are the only thing that's important.If it was "a meeting place", then pick some other object and claim it was the meeting place. No one will know the difference because any piece of rubble is as good as any other.If it was "a simple morale boost", then you've got to explain why looking at the remains of a destroyed building would boost the moral of people who were extremely upset because of the remains of a destroyed building. What specifically was it about this chunk of the building that boosted moral over the piece of cement to the left or the guy's arm to the right?

Are you being serious?You REALLY think that Muslim Americans found _SPIRITUAL COMFORT_ in a Christian symbol on the site of a terrorist attack which lead many Christians to seek out and kill people they thought were muslim.You REALLY think that the Buddhist relatives of victims of the attack, which was - let's face it, a religious attack by Islamists against a power they saw is being anti-Islam, pro-Israel and Christian, found SPIRITUAL COMFORT in being reminded that THEIR RELIGION doesn't count in the eyes of the two parties involved? That they were just innocent victims of some stupid religious war between the Jews, the 2nd Jews and the 3rd Jews?REALLY?!Come on.

I think there is some fundamental things you don't understand about other religions.Muslims aren't just another kind of Protestant. Buddhists aren't some sect of Jesuits.These are religious groups which fundamentally disagree with your own. They don't hold the cross to be sacred, and in many instances find it offensive.For example, when you mount a cross as some sort of rallying cry to wage war on members of another religion - like this cross is.Or if you use the cross as some sort of memorial to the dead of other religions - which this cross is also doing.It's offensive.

Can't have it both ways. Either it's a bit of the building an it belongs there no matter what the orientation
-or-
There is an "upright" orientation, and it's not *just* a bit of building, in which case it needs to go.What I still don't understand is why Christians what to rub it in everyone's face that they believe that their God WANTED 9/11 to happen.It seems counter productive to the point of the museum.

Pretending you didn't lose an argument earlier in the thread doesn't make those pages of the thread disappear.I refer you back to your previous attempts to prove this in which you fail miserably. Neither, it's because you clearly don't understand that just because you are a Christian, that doesn't make everyone else ALSO a Christian. You already lost the legal debate.What I've moved onto is the fact that chrisitans are trying to brag about the fact that their God killed thousands of Americans and what to mount a symbol on the site to shove it in everyone's face.That's offensive.

The topic of the thread refers to a groups legal challenge to prevent Christians from hijacking the 9/11 museum with their iconography simply because right angles are popular in construction.I would think that 250 messages in you would actually bother to figure out what the debate is about. Seems like a waste to be posting if you don't understand the topic

Really? Rather than go back and read the thread to remind yourself what's being discussed, you post off topic cartoons?Let me hold you hand through this.Christians are arguing that a piece of metal from the 9/11 site is magical because, unlike every other crossbeam in existence, this one is shaped like a T. Therefore they want to put it in a museum.Atheists are pointing out that the Christians are selecting this particular piece of trash because they think it looks like the symbol of their religion. If that's the reason they want to include it in a museum which is not about their religion, they are in violation of church and state.Christians counter with "This magic T is special because it 'helped' people".Atheists asked for specifics.Christians told us "Well, it helped people because it's the letter T".Then that whole line of argument was repeated for 270 posts.At which point you apparently forgot what he been said, so I brought you back up to speed.

So, it's a "cross", not a piece of the building. Not a significant marker of some body. Not a rallying point.It's a _CROSS_.Done. You lose.

A cross serves no informative, historical or specific information about 9/11It's merely a symbol of one group who is retroactively claiming responsibility for the deaths of thousands of Americans.Putting it in the museum serves no purpose other than to insult people of other faiths.

Do you understand that repeating the same l.i.e. doesn't make it true?This object is ONLY a symbol. As is evidenced by the fact that EVEN YOU admit that it only has value if mounted "in the proper Christian position" as opposed to any other orientation. The "role" is played was for Christians to imply that their God caused 9/11 to happen.That role is not something which this museum, or frankly any museum, should be glorifying.

Show me one person that this object dug up.
Show me one building that this object moved.This object didn't "help" anyone.The closest it comes to "help" is for the few Christians there to use it as a bragging point while thumbing their noses at the rest of the workers saying "See, our God did all this. F all of you! We win!"That's NOT helpful and it's CERTAINLY NOT sufficient to include it in a museum about a trajedy.If you want to open a 2nd museum called "See Christians be A-holes", then feel free. You can include this hunk of shit, as well as burning crosses put up by the KKK, and a few picks of the Indian taxi driver who was beaten to death by Christians unsatisfied with the death toll on 9/11.As for the rest of us, keep your filthy religion out of our public spaces.

You are the one making the extraordinary claim that this object some how took action and saved people's lives. That this object did some actual digging. That this object grabbed a mic and said "There is a body over under that piece of concrete. Look, where I am pointing".None of those things ACTUALLY happened.Instead, the "help" this object provided was that SOME rescuers were religious people who took pride in the destruction their God had wrought upon the people of NYC and saw this piece of garbage as evidence that their God killed 3,000 people.Good for them! Tell them to take that shit to some museum that glorifies that sort of shit. Not for long.You religions fucktards have spent too much time thumbing your nose at the Constitution. We're starting to fight back, to actually DEFEND America instead of crapping all over it.And all we can hear from you guys is crying about how "hard it is to be a Christian". Boo fucking hoo.If you want to brag about killing 3000 Americans, be a fucking man, and OWN UP TO THAT SHIT.Just trying to sneak that bullshit into a museum is pathetic.

Oh, of course not. You've only said that this object "helped people" in a non-religious capacity.And when pressed, you repeat yourself. "People were helped".In what way was this object "helpful" to people?The answer you don't want to give:
"Because Christians saw it and knew that their God caused this death and destruction and so they were overjoyed".Great. Fantastic. You worship a demon. Good for you.Take you letter T home and put it on a wall.