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Author | Topic: The power of prayer: in action | |||||||||||||||||||||||
Dan Carroll Inactive Member |
One Christian colleague, recently lost her wallet in the streets of Sydney. She contacted all of her Christian friends who prayed for the wallet's return, and within a couple of days she had it back. Another impressive power of prayer anecdote. Meanwhile... It's good that God had the time to personally return her wallet, though. And that she saw the safe return of her wallet as a top priority which warranted the mass mobilization of her friends' prayers. "If I had to write ten jokes about potholders, I don't think I could do it. But I could write ten jokes about Catholicism in the next twenty minutes. I guess I'm drawn to religion because I can be provocative without harming something people really care about, like their cars." -George Meyer, Simpsons writer
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Dan Carroll Inactive Member |
This might be the time to ressurect my old prayer/drugs/meditation thread. But I don't know where it is.
Any admins know? "If I had to write ten jokes about potholders, I don't think I could do it. But I could write ten jokes about Catholicism in the next twenty minutes. I guess I'm drawn to religion because I can be provocative without harming something people really care about, like their cars." -George Meyer, Simpsons writer |
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Dan Carroll Inactive Member |
I'd like some orange soda.
Does this mean God is working through Schraf to tell me I want orange soda?
It's good to know he's got the time to do that. "If I had to write ten jokes about potholders, I don't think I could do it. But I could write ten jokes about Catholicism in the next twenty minutes. I guess I'm drawn to religion because I can be provocative without harming something people really care about, like their cars." -George Meyer, Simpsons writer
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Dan Carroll Inactive Member |
You asked God for a place, and he said orange soda? You know what this means. God is a dadaist?
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Dan Carroll Inactive Member |
You were being deliberatly irrational? Because thats what I felt anyway. Yes, riVeRraT. When I said "God", I meant "Dan". Right on the nose, good work.
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Dan Carroll Inactive Member |
Wow, Dan, God just gave me words for you. Good to see he's got nothing better to do.
You know, you did ask God, he told me that. Ask him for what? If I did something, I'd kind of like to know what it was.
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Dan Carroll Inactive Member |
What are you doing about it? More than God. Hell, just saying, "Y'know, that should stop" is doing more than God.
It also doesn't mean that God doesn't exist. No... only that he thinks that whispering in peoples' ears about orange soda is a top priority.
Why does everyone confuse man with God, then blame God? You were the one who suggested that God mucks about with mankind, answering prayers. I'm sure there are people who pray for an end to violence. So why does God answer peoples' prayers about meaningless crap, and let the big stuff slide?
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Dan Carroll Inactive Member |
Do you think that a God as powerful as our God, cannot answer all prayers at the same time? Is not a day like a thousand years to God. Can we understand why these bigger issues take longer to solve than a small question about orange soda? Do you not see how the end of this paragraph contradicts the start of this paragraph? I mean directly contradicts it? If God is as powerful as you say, then there is no reason why these bigger issues should take any longer.
In our feeble little minds we have a hard time seeing the bigger picture. Speak for yourself, guy.
Just because you don't see righteousness being done here and now, does not mean that it won't eventually be done. So God'll get around to this stuff later. For now he's got important soda-related matters to attend to. Got it.
Our life extends beyond what happens here on earth. So... what, the things that happen on Earth are unimportant to God because of that? (Except for soda-related matters, of course.) Wow.
You don't believe that, so you are trapped into thinking that righteousness needs to happen right now for there to be a God. Actually, I don't believe in God for a number of reasons. But it just seems odd to me that God would personally take the time out to tell you where to pray, but let millions of people die in Africa.
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Dan Carroll Inactive Member |
Not for God, but for us. We have to get our selves out of our own mess. Unless, of course, it's about losing wallet, or figuring out where to pray. Then God's totally comfortable stepping in and sorting things out for you.
If you have it all figured then, let all of us in on it, we are dying to know. Okay: there's no God. What you see is what you get. Enjoy!
You expect God to come down everytime man does something wrong, and straighten it out? Heck, long as he's coming down anyway to make sure you don't pick the wrong prayer spot, it sure would be nice of him.
Can you see into the minds and hearts of the African nation? Because you seem to be speaking for them, and exactly how they feel. I'm sorry, everyone. It was ethnocentric of me to just go ahead and assume that Africans don't like to be killed.
You see God has given them everything they need to have it good. You're right. They should really appreciate just how good they have it over there.
Tell me, just how do you plan to change the world? Heck, I do my part by doing what I can for everyone I encounter. I just wish God would do the same. That'd be awful swell of him.
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Dan Carroll Inactive Member |
Prove it. I'm sorry, I'm busy proving that there are no invisible, intangible, inch-tall baboons crawling around inside my rectum. Once I've got that done, I'll move on to God. But let's humor you a second. You say there's a God. Cool. What's "God"? I'm not asking for a resume line, such as "the creator of the Earth". I'm asking for what it is. Once you've established that, you can start quibbling about whether or not it's there.
What about the Africans that enjoy killing? What about them? I don't recall speaking on their behalf one way or the other. The only thing I said about them was that it was within God's power to stop them, and that he chooses not to do so, presumably because he's far too busy making damn sure you pray in the right spot.
You act like you've been around since the start of time, and have seen all the chances God has gave them/us. I see... so the millions of Africans killed thus far simply didn't take advantage of the many chances God gave them to have an awesome life. You should tell them that. I'm sure they'll appreciate it. (Oops, there I go assuming that Africans want an awesome life.)
Now there's a word twist, Brilliant! I notice you don't say how I twisted your words. Only that I did.
I'm sorry to say this, but taking God out of the picture, and teaching others to feel the same way, to me is not really helping. It sure would be a shame if people were just good to each other for the sake of doing so, rather than because God expected it of them. What a nightmare world that would be.
Finding out who God really is, and going out in the world, and spreading the Love would help. Heck, I can't even get anyone to tell me what God really is! Besides, I have yet to see all this love God is laying down on the people. I guess he loves the Africans by allowing all that pain and death? (Although in fairness, I can't say for sure if they don't like pain and death. Hey, maybe they do, and it is God's way of loving them!) This message has been edited by Dan Carroll, 10-28-2004 02:59 PM
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Dan Carroll Inactive Member |
I think you have a lot to learn. Your ignorance will continue to keep you from what is righteous. Considering you skipped half my post in favor of just calling me ignorant, I'm not overly concerned.
I can give you an example. What is one of the reasons Musslims do not want Christianity in their nations. I'll give you a hint: womens rights. And this has the sum total of what do to with an African child born into a war zone having "everything he needs" to live an awesome life?
Whats wrong with both? As long as someone believes in God, I see no problem with them doing something good both because it's good and because they love God. I also see nothing wrong with someone doing good because it's good, and because they love delicious chicken salad sandwiches. Of course, It'd be stupid if I told someone that they could not do good without chicken salad sandwiches. Try and learn from this little parable.
I think most of your answers lie within your own posts. That's good, because you're sure as Hell not answering anything.
You want to know what/who God really is? Look right inside your own heart, I promise you he's there. See above, re: not answering. "If I had to write ten jokes about potholders, I don't think I could do it. But I could write ten jokes about Catholicism in the next twenty minutes. I guess I'm drawn to religion because I can be provocative without harming something people really care about, like their cars." -George Meyer, Simpsons writer
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Dan Carroll Inactive Member |
almost orgasmic. Something I never felt before Watch my complete and utter lack of shock.
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Dan Carroll Inactive Member |
This is where you mis-understand me. I agree with you. I keep telling everyone, I am not here to judge or say you need God to be good. See, this just isn't true. In response to me saying how I help others, your exact words were, "I'm sorry to say this, but taking God out of the picture, and teaching others to feel the same way, to me is not really helping."
And I really wish you would stop twisting what I am saying about people in Africa. Its pretty simple. As a nation they have everything they need to be happy. And as individuals, they most certainly do not. Once again, how does a child born into a war zone have everything he/she needs to be happy?
Its by the fault of man that they don't. Not by the fault of God. It's our(man's) responsibility to correct the situation, not God's. It is by no fault of the individuals that they are in this situation. If God is everything you say it is, then it has the power to help these individuals. But it chooses not to do so. Meanwhile, God does choose to help you find the right place to pray. Again... God's priorities, as far as who he's willing to help, and with what, are utterly fucked.
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Dan Carroll Inactive Member |
I meant this in respect to teaching others that God is not necessary at all. That is just as bad as me teaching you God is necessary. Again, it would sure be a nightmare if people just did the right thing because it was the right thing, without God being involved at all.
As individuals he/she is screwd, by.....man! And a nation. Yes, and I don't recall ever saying otherwise. I've said that God has the power to help them and can't be bothered, not that God is directly responsible for their woes.
But its not God's responsobility to save them. It must be nice to have that much power, and no responsibility whatsoever to use it to help others.
I can't possibly know whats going on over there, unless I go there and see it first hand. Actually, you can read the news, and count the dying. You can't actually see the bullet cracking their skull and drilling into their brain, but you can still know it happened. Then you can make the wild assumption that people dying for no reason is bad.
I think our points have been made. You just don't see the relevance, and want to blame God for everything. I love when people tell me what I want. It's such a treat.
You look at like priorities, how could you possibly know his priorities? By looking at what he does and doesn't do. What he does do is clearly a higher priority. Pretty simple, when you think about it.
If you were able to do a million things at the same time, wouldn't the quicker tasks get done before the longer tasks? No. They would be done at the same time.
Maybe the quicker tasks are needed to complete the longer tasks. So is God all-powerful or isn't he? If he is, then this is bunk.
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Dan Carroll Inactive Member |
Does and doesn't is present tense thinking. You fail to look at what he has done, doing, and going to do. Has done: Told you where to pray, allowed many many people to die in Africa. Doing, going to do: Who knows? But while he's been getting around to it, millions of people have died.
Maybe they are for him. And that's just a lovely abstract thought. Maybe we can put it on a sign, and hang it over a mass grave or two.
Go ahead, solve E=MC^2 and 2+2 in the same amount of time. Can't. Of course, I'm not omnipotent and omniscient. God is, apparently.
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