Is God determined to allow no proof or evidence of his existence?

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All laws follow the same basic idea that murder is wrong, that stealing is wrong, rape, physical abuse, and so forth. If the Bible was made up, then the basic ideas of love and joy being good and anger and hatred being bad still had to come from something

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But all of those things are in texts that pre-date the bible? How do you know the authors of the bible did not just do a cut 'n' paste?

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n a book comprised of 66 books, written by about 35 to 40 authors, in the span of almost 1500 years, and for this book to have no apparant contradiction, to follow the same theme, and to present the same message, is proof enough to show it has certain probability of being true.

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em... because all the authors saw the other bits - Comic book writers do this all the time - it does not mean that Superman is real. In addition, we have numerous threads here that examine elements of the bible that do NOT match up. So that claim is a bust.

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Then there is the staggaring odds of Jesus fulfilling all the prophesies written about Him hundreds of years before. The historical accuracy for which the Bible is written.

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I'm not quite sure what you are getting at - but I think you are engaged in circular reasoning.

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And for my own proof, my own witness to the presence of God. I have seen miracles as described in the Bible, I have studied the Bible and seen how it's been very real and correct in all the things it says. I have a very personal and real relationship with the Lord God, and Jesus Christ and when you speak with someone face to face, it's hard for someone to tell you that it isn't real. It's like telling me that this computer which i am typing on is not there at all, that it's a lie and i'm decieving myself. When i look at the evidences of God, the Bible, and Jesus Christ, they are only secondary evidence that support what i already know. I don't need a picture of someone to know if they're real if i have already met them and spoken with them.

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I'm glad that makes you happy but it's means less than nothing to me and many other like me (To be blunt).

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Well to be blunt, any judge or jury would find a eye-witness account very important in any case, and it should mean more to you and anyone else becuase it's the basis of almost every fact on earth.

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What is the percentage of oxygen in the air ? I am telling you from taking a deep breath that it is about 50%. I am known locally for my honest nature - surely that convinces you.I have some muslim "eyewitnesses" who say that your bible is incorrect - are both sets of "eyewitnesses" correct? What about the Jews? they say that both of you are incorrect!Oh who's this at the door? Why it's my friend Sam - What's that Sam? All three are wrong and Jesus is a knock-off of Krishna?Oh dear - I'm very confused all of those "eyewitnesses" are honest people but they are all telling me different things - how can they all be right?This message has been edited by Charles Knight, 24-May-2005 05:36 PM

Mr.E is right - this is off topic here but to finish - there was no slam intended - I am just pointing out that eyewitnesses from other faiths would say that you are wrong - if they say you are wrong, what's to say that they are not right!What level of evidence do you require to show that the different world religion disagree about many major and minor points? Are you saying ALL of those religions are right about ALL things?If you could point me towards the personal slam I'd be interested to see it. I think you need to understand that to many of us on this board the bible and the christian god is as likely as any piece of popular fiction. That's not a slam on your faith but just a FYI to saving you a lot of typing. Testimony based posts cut no ice at all in most of the forums/active threads here.