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Author Topic:   NDE
helena 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5875 days)
Posts: 80
Joined: 03-27-2008


Message 123 of 130 (65822)
11-11-2003 12:11 PM
Reply to: Message 122 by Rrhain
11-11-2003 8:20 AM


I would just like to make one or two remarks on your comments, Rrhain.
Stating Maxwell's equations isn't going to help your point a lot, as we indeed cannot fully say, how electric charge comes about from a very fundamental point of view. Maxwell's equations (mid 19th century IIRC) are indeed a very nice set of rules about how the electromagnetic field behaves (and that indeed the electric and magnetic forces have the same origin). But they do not explain the origin of its "players" (charge etc.)
Having said that, I must strongly disagree with the notion that if we do not (fully) understand something it must necessarily be caused by a god, a set of gods, or the great galactic goat..
There have been a lot of things, that were once thought to be caused by influences without the range of our perception (demons, fairies or indeed god). As knowledge progressed, we have learned about bacteria, viri etc. so that we do not need to invoke an outwordly power for the observed effects.
I'm absolutely confident that one day we will know the answers to these questions. We will probably then find ourselves faced with a couple of new ones, nobody thought of yet. As I'm also sure that some people will invoke a god (most likely the one Jews, Christians and Muslims worship) for the explanation of these questions.
regards

This message is a reply to:
 Message 122 by Rrhain, posted 11-11-2003 8:20 AM Rrhain has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 124 by Rrhain, posted 11-11-2003 1:14 PM helena has replied

  
helena 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5875 days)
Posts: 80
Joined: 03-27-2008


Message 125 of 130 (65875)
11-11-2003 3:31 PM
Reply to: Message 124 by Rrhain
11-11-2003 1:14 PM


quote:
Why? The equations seem to work. So unless you're going to move the goalposts and say that we don't know where the fundamental constants involved in the equations come from or something similar, then they do, indeed, tell us where electric charge comes from.
no contest to the first part - they do work..
and I think we might be arguing the same point but using different wording..
quote:
Logical error: Moving the goalposts.
The question, then, is not about electricity but why the universe is the way it is...why there is even such a thing as electricity in the first place.
Now, that's a really interesting question.
again, no contest here...
but, you will also have to agree, that the Maxwell equations are based on the following observations, if you will:
(a) sign-separated charges exist (they can have a non-neutral density rho)
(b) magnetic monopoles don't exist
(c) magnetic and electric field are connected with one another as stated.
so, what I am saying is that the basis for Maxwell's equation is the existence of charges.. or in other words: They are a phenomenological description of what experiments have told us about electromagnetics, nothing less - nothing more. Why they turn out to be exactly what they are is the interesting question.
regards

This message is a reply to:
 Message 124 by Rrhain, posted 11-11-2003 1:14 PM Rrhain has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 126 by Rrhain, posted 11-12-2003 12:28 AM helena has replied

  
helena 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5875 days)
Posts: 80
Joined: 03-27-2008


Message 127 of 130 (65977)
11-12-2003 3:21 AM
Reply to: Message 126 by Rrhain
11-12-2003 12:28 AM


quote:
Actually, if I recall what I have read correctly, string theory does allow monopoles. And interestingly enough, with enough monopoles of one type, you can create the opposite one.
Indeed, we haven't seen any, but that's something different (though a recent article in Science claims that there is indirect evidence for their existence, Z Fang et al. 2003 Science 302 92). And Dirac's work seems to allow for magnetic monopoles in quantum mechanics. One of the reasons for inflation theory was to explain the seeming absence of magnetic monopoles and all evidence seems to be pointing toward an inflationary period in the universe.
my point was just, that Maxwell's equations do not allow for them (otherwise divB /= 0).
best regards

This message is a reply to:
 Message 126 by Rrhain, posted 11-12-2003 12:28 AM Rrhain has not replied

  
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