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Author Topic:   Gun Control III
marc9000
Member
Posts: 1314
From: Ky U.S.
Joined: 12-25-2009


Message 1037 of 1110 (895267)
06-18-2022 10:57 PM
Reply to: Message 1032 by Percy
06-17-2022 10:59 AM


Re: Biden's speech
Percy writes:
The reality is that the media is your favorite whipping boy. You've blamed them for innumerable things over the years.

Just like law abiding citizens with guns are your favorite whipping boy?

Why not just accuse me of being a communist?
Because I don't name call. You propose laws for NO ONE but law abiding citizens, as if that will cause a huge number of guns to magically disappear. Can't you learn from history, that prohibition DID NOT cause the consumption of alcohol to diminish in any meaningful way? That it caused nothing but additional trouble?
Probably producers and anchors and other high ranking staff in consultation together make these decisions. And yes, of course for a sitting president when he uses the airwaves to undermine democracy. It was known Trump was telling lies then, and he's still telling the same lies.
And Biden never lied when he said "I'M GOING TO SHUT DOWN THE VIRUS", several times during his campaign? The media didn't cut him off.
There are other examples;
Joe Biden's Top 10 Lies of 2021
When it's factual that producers, anchors, and other high ranking staff in the mainstream media overwhelmingly vote for Democrats, they still make sure their news reporting is politically unbiased?
If you have no defense for your years of insupportable accusations against the media, just say so.
As you know, I've supported them. If you want to keep claiming that the mainstream media is completely unbiased, okay. Your helpers will call me names for it, and we'll just have to leave it there.
I have often said that politicians are all of the same breed. They possess similar qualities, it goes with wanting the job. Naturally some are better than others when it comes to honesty and integrity, but did any previous president, Republican or Democrat, ever lie in ways that threatened the foundation of democracy?
What way is that, trying to incrementally destroy the second amendment? How did Trump equally threaten the foundation of democracy? Getting off the backs of oil companies so the U.S. became energy independent?
Now you're just employing scare tactics. Quality gun control would involve registration of firearms, licensing of firearm owners, and hopefully safety improvements to the firearms themselves.
So the government knows who has them, so taking the future step of confiscation becomes easy for them. I love how climate change alarmists accuse OTHERS of "scare tactics".
marc9000 writes:
The more government requirements there are for skilled marksmen, the fewer skilled marksmen there are going to be.

Uh, okay, possibly. So?
So if an unforeseeable event happens in the future (Ukraine?) where as many citizens as possible need to be armed, there would be fewer people who would know how to use them. I know, a laugher, just like on September 10 2001, the thought of U.S. planes being flown into buildings by terrorists was a laugher.
I think we need laws that benefit the most people (i.e., result in the fewest firearm related deaths), not that address one-of events that pull at the heart strings.
LIKE MASS SHOOTINGS? They're "one-of" events exactly like a zoo emergency, until the news media smells a buck. Then they're big stuff for ONE kind of law, get the guns from law abiding citizens!!! Forget about mental illness, atheism taught in science classes, decay of morals, and a half dozen other things.
I see you chopped the alert to your sarcasm detecter off what you quoted. Anyway, what I've actually said about gun nuts is that they're in love with guns. The guns have an almost mystical power over them that allows them, and you're a good example, to simply deny or ignore all the evidence of their danger and the damage they're doing to our society.
Some would say the mystical power of the brutality of football over football fans is a danger to society. Or violent video games. Or the murder of the unborn. Or climate change hysteria. Or a half dozen other things that have a mystical power over Democrats / Trump haters.
marc9000 writes:
That you have to ask that, makes it clear that you have no appreciation of the freedoms you enjoy in the U.S.

Why can't you explain why you thought that point relevant or important? Is it because you're talking through your hat again? To repeat the question, how is my familiarity with what the general public knows relevant or meaningful? Giving no response and just claiming it's obvious is an undeniable deflection that raises serious doubts about whether you have an actual point.
My point is that I don't believe a free society can be maintained if many of its people so much take it for granted, that they have no concern for increasing apathy in their fellow citizens, who could be blind to the forces that want to destroy everyone's freedom, as has happened numerous times in world history.
Now you're just echoing false claims from the New York Post (Murdoch Corporation) and the Washington Times (Sun Myung Moon and the Unification Church) and other conservative media that have little interest in truth and accuracy.
Just like I don't believe the NY Times, Washington Post, and CNN have much interest in truth and accuracy. (and I'm not alone)
Fewer Americans Than Ever Before Trust The Mainstream Media
Let's keep the discussion anchored in reality. No one besides you is promoting conspiracy theories, including where you accuse others of promoting conspiracy theories.
quote
These days you can pretty much bank on the Democrats and the Left moving from one conspiracy theory to the next. . . to the next, desperately hoping that somehow that can make a conspiracy theory real. They’ve gone from Russian collusion to Ukrainian Quid Pro Quo to the U.S. Postal Service (USPS) hoax. At some point, one expects them to solemnly intone that in reality Donald Trump is an alien. If we had a real media interested in truth and accountability, these hoaxes and conspiracy theories would be laughed out of the building by serious, thoughtful people - but they aren't.
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/...racy_theory_144077.html#!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1032 by Percy, posted 06-17-2022 10:59 AM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1062 by Percy, posted 06-27-2022 12:23 PM marc9000 has replied

  
marc9000
Member
Posts: 1314
From: Ky U.S.
Joined: 12-25-2009


Message 1038 of 1110 (895268)
06-18-2022 11:02 PM
Reply to: Message 1033 by Percy
06-17-2022 11:16 AM


Re: Biden's speech
But I think you're drifting off-topic. This thread's about gun control.
Message 1015
Message 1017
Message 1019
Message 1020
Message 1023
Message 1031
I'll accept 14% of the blame.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1033 by Percy, posted 06-17-2022 11:16 AM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1042 by Percy, posted 06-19-2022 10:35 AM marc9000 has not replied

  
marc9000
Member
Posts: 1314
From: Ky U.S.
Joined: 12-25-2009


Message 1039 of 1110 (895269)
06-18-2022 11:11 PM
Reply to: Message 1034 by AZPaul3
06-17-2022 11:01 PM


Re: Biden's speech
As well you should believe him. That pipeline construction extension wasn’t productive. It wasn’t carrying any oil. It was still under construction. It’s untightened nuts and bolts have not the slightest effect on today's fuel prices. What a dunce.
Almost no product functions until it's complete. If it wasn't carrying oil while it was being constructed, that doesn't mean that it could never have carried oil. If Biden hadn't closed it, it would have many tight nuts and bolts, and would be nearer completion so it could carry oil, and help satisfy a world market.
If you don't understand, please babble some more, I LOVE this place!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1034 by AZPaul3, posted 06-17-2022 11:01 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1040 by AZPaul3, posted 06-19-2022 2:21 AM marc9000 has not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6837
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 3.5


(2)
Message 1040 of 1110 (895270)
06-19-2022 2:21 AM
Reply to: Message 1039 by marc9000
06-18-2022 11:11 PM


Re: Biden's speech
Your lying contention was that Biden stopped the flow of the Keystone pipeline. That was a fuckin' lie. Your lie was that his stopping Keystone caused the price increases. A fuckin lie. Stopping the extension had no effect either. Another fuckin' lie.
Now you're lying about the topic trying to cover up your lie.
Lies, lies, and more lies. Is that all a christian knows how to do? No wonder you guys are losing your ass in the public sphere.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1039 by marc9000, posted 06-18-2022 11:11 PM marc9000 has not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 20988
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 1041 of 1110 (895271)
06-19-2022 10:16 AM
Reply to: Message 1036 by marc9000
06-18-2022 10:00 PM


Re: Biden's speech
There is a worldwide shortage and price spike of oil. Any blockage of transportation or production from ANY one place to ANY other place in the world is going is going to cause an increase in scarcity and price. In oil or any product. I know you could never understand it, few posters here could, I'm surprised you only got 2 green dots.
Why do you insist on saying things that are patently untrue. Supply and demand is a simple concept understood by even young school children.
The extension to the Keystone Pipeline would have carried tar sands oil, the dirtiest in the world. The production of tar sands oil in Alberta has been an environmental disaster. Here's a nice image of what tar sands oil extraction does to the environment:
Those are slag ponds, by the way, not clean water. By encouraging the use of tar sands oil we leave a legacy of environmental destruction for the future to deal with. While electricity itself is very clean, the production of electricity can be incredibly dirty while producing green house gases (coal) or very clean while still producing green house gases (natural gas) or extremely clean (hydroelectric, solar, wind, nuclear when the disposal problem is addressed).
But I don't see what this has to do with gun control. Maybe this can be taken to another thread.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1036 by marc9000, posted 06-18-2022 10:00 PM marc9000 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1044 by marc9000, posted 06-19-2022 5:38 PM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 20988
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 1042 of 1110 (895272)
06-19-2022 10:35 AM
Reply to: Message 1038 by marc9000
06-18-2022 11:02 PM


Re: Biden's speech
marc9000 writes:
But I think you're drifting off-topic. This thread's about gun control.
Message 1015
Message 1017
Message 1019
Message 1020
Message 1023
Message 1031
I'll accept 14% of the blame.
All topics drift and touch on unrelated topics, but some people have a tendency to raise irrelevant topics. They might introduce the news media or start discussing energy issues in a thread about gun control. When discussion of their subtopics completely abandons the topic and begins to lengthen then the question should be asked whether discussion of that subtopic should be moved to another thread.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1038 by marc9000, posted 06-18-2022 11:02 PM marc9000 has not replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 3437
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 4.3


(4)
Message 1043 of 1110 (895273)
06-19-2022 10:58 AM
Reply to: Message 1036 by marc9000
06-18-2022 10:00 PM


Re: Biden's speech
Trump's energy policies.
Trump never had any energy policies. He is a con man and he doesn't know jack fucking shit about any subject that he opened his mouth about. And you turned out to be just as ignorant about everything you say. You're bullshit peddlers.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1036 by marc9000, posted 06-18-2022 10:00 PM marc9000 has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1045 by Percy, posted 06-19-2022 8:20 PM Tanypteryx has replied

  
marc9000
Member
Posts: 1314
From: Ky U.S.
Joined: 12-25-2009


Message 1044 of 1110 (895276)
06-19-2022 5:38 PM
Reply to: Message 1041 by Percy
06-19-2022 10:16 AM


Re: Biden's speech
Maybe this can be taken to another thread.
I'll start a new, narrowly focused one.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1041 by Percy, posted 06-19-2022 10:16 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 20988
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 1045 of 1110 (895279)
06-19-2022 8:20 PM
Reply to: Message 1043 by Tanypteryx
06-19-2022 10:58 AM


Re: Biden's speech
Tanypteryx writes:
Trump never had any energy policies.
Or maybe he did, but they were like all his other policies: exploitation for maximum profit no matter what the cost to future generations.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1043 by Tanypteryx, posted 06-19-2022 10:58 AM Tanypteryx has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1059 by Tanypteryx, posted 06-26-2022 11:51 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 20988
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.4


(2)
Message 1046 of 1110 (895341)
06-22-2022 5:38 PM
Reply to: Message 1004 by Percy
06-09-2022 9:45 AM


Re: Where are all the good guys with guns?
More on good guys with guns and how wonderfully effective they are. Today's NYT ran an article about it: Who Stops a ‘Bad Guy With a Gun’?. I'll summarize.
433 active shooting attacks since 2000 ended this way:
  • 113: the attacked left the scene
  • 110: the attacker committed suicide
  • 98: police shot the attacker
  • 33: police subdued the attacker
  • 42: a bystander subdued the attacker
  • 22: a bystander/security guard/off-duty officer shot the attacker
  • 15: the attacker surrendered
A good guy with a gun stopped a bad guy with a gun in 22 of 433 cases, or 5% of the time.
A good guy without a gun stopped a bad guy with a gun in 42 of 433 cases, or nearly 10% of the time.
Police stopped a bad guy with a gun, either by subduing him or shooting him, about 30% of the time.
Hopefully this ends the myth, at least in this thread, that the answer to the gun problem is more good guys with guns.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1004 by Percy, posted 06-09-2022 9:45 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1047 by Tangle, posted 06-22-2022 6:18 PM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 8580
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.0


Message 1047 of 1110 (895343)
06-22-2022 6:18 PM
Reply to: Message 1046 by Percy
06-22-2022 5:38 PM


Re: Where are all the good guys with guns?
You're not thinking straight Percy. If everyone had to carry a gun by law, then, as there's more good guys than bad guys, it would obviously work out. The trick is to arm everyone.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1046 by Percy, posted 06-22-2022 5:38 PM Percy has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1048 by marc9000, posted 06-22-2022 9:06 PM Tangle has replied

  
marc9000
Member
Posts: 1314
From: Ky U.S.
Joined: 12-25-2009


Message 1048 of 1110 (895346)
06-22-2022 9:06 PM
Reply to: Message 1047 by Tangle
06-22-2022 6:18 PM


Re: Where are all the good guys with guns?
You're not thinking straight Percy. If everyone had to carry a gun by law, then, as there's more good guys than bad guys, it would obviously work out. The trick is to arm everyone.
Very good, that's how Switzerland does it.
quote
As for gun-related crime in general, a 2001 BBC article reported that in Switzerland “the gun crime rate is so low that statistics are not even kept.”
Gun Ownership in Switzerland

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1047 by Tangle, posted 06-22-2022 6:18 PM Tangle has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1049 by Tangle, posted 06-23-2022 3:38 AM marc9000 has not replied
 Message 1061 by Theodoric, posted 06-27-2022 9:32 AM marc9000 has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 8580
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 3.0


(1)
Message 1049 of 1110 (895348)
06-23-2022 3:38 AM
Reply to: Message 1048 by marc9000
06-22-2022 9:06 PM


Re: Where are all the good guys with guns?
Oh I think you can do better than Switzerland, they leave their rifles at home and have a silly law that makes it illegal to carry a gun in the street - totally pointless.
No, you need to properly arm everybody all the time. It needs to be illegal for every adult not to open carry hand guns in public. And every teacher and store owner must have an assault rifle on their desks and counters, just in case.
That'd do it.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1048 by marc9000, posted 06-22-2022 9:06 PM marc9000 has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1050 by AZPaul3, posted 06-23-2022 5:07 AM Tangle has not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6837
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 3.5


(2)
Message 1050 of 1110 (895349)
06-23-2022 5:07 AM
Reply to: Message 1049 by Tangle
06-23-2022 3:38 AM


Re: Where are all the good guys with guns?
Oh, I'm sure any good guys with guns would still wait until the shooter was done reloading a second time before risking their lives. This is America. Gotta be extra careful around a gun culture. It can get YOU killed instead of the bad guy.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1049 by Tangle, posted 06-23-2022 3:38 AM Tangle has not replied

  
AnswersInGenitals
Member
Posts: 672
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 3.3


(3)
Message 1051 of 1110 (895361)
06-23-2022 4:56 PM


Our Well Regulated Militia
I am a strong supporter of the Constitution's second amendment:
"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."
I want us to live in a free state and for that state to be secure. To that end, we have a well regulated Militia made up of the people, US citizens, who keep and bear arms.
It is called The United States Department of Defense.

Replies to this message:
 Message 1052 by marc9000, posted 06-23-2022 9:51 PM AnswersInGenitals has not replied

  
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