A Deteriorating State :: Morality in the 21st Century

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What's the difference between a liberal and religious fundamentalist?

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Usually education.

So, what characterizes all liberals and religious fundamentalists such that they can be considered one and the same?Defining your terms would be welcome.Edited by nator, : No reason given.

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So, as one becomes more educated, one also becomes more liberal? Will you back up that that is usually the case?

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As people become more educated, they become less likely to be religious fundamentalists.We can use the public's beliefs about Evolution vs. belief in the Genesis account of creation as one measure.The following are the percentages of people in various groups who believe, from left to right, The literal Genesis account of creation, Theistic Evolution, and Evolution in which God had no hand in.Everyone 47% 40% 9%
Men 39% 45% 11.5%
Women 53% 36% 6.6%
College graduates 25% 54% 16.5%
No high school diploma 65% 23% 4.6%As you can see, the greater the educational level, the less likely it is for people to hold dogmatic fundamentalist religious views on this issue. Results from 1997:When people become highly educated in the sciences, the difference becomes even more stark. Results from 1997:Everyone 44% 39% 10%
Scientists 5% 40% 55% sourceIt is also the case that more educated people tend to be more liberal.Remember that on-line book by Dr. Bob Altemeyer, PhD called The Authoritarians that was mentioned in the Book Nook a little while back? He is a research Psychologist and he has shown in his work that people who tend to score high on his Right Wing Authoritarianism (RWA) scale showed a drop of 15-20% after completeion of a 4-year college education. RWA correleates strongly with religious fundamentalism.Edited by nator, : No reason given.

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Not all liberals, just liberals in general. Liberal, conservative, religious fundamentalist, atheist, Christian, Muslim, Hindu, etc. are all systems of morality/beliefs. Agnosticism is the method of logical evaluation of only those things known, with no assumptions, upon which science, truth, and knowledge are built.

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Er, OK, but now I have no clue what you are talking about.I am an Agnostic, but I'm also pretty liberal.My liberal views have been arrived at through rational analysis. I also hold some conservative views and some libertarian views and some socialist views, to name a few flavors. Some of my political, social, and economic views have changed radically, some have remained unchanged.I am not sure it is appropriate to lump static religiously-held faith-based dogma along with growing, changing-through-experience political, social, and economic attitudes.

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That wasn't your original argument.

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Yes, actually it was:You wrote:

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What's the difference between a liberal and religious fundamentalist?

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I replied: You see, being "liberal" and being "religious fundamentalist", according to my understanding of the definitions, are antithetical.One simply cannot be both at the same time.This is why I asked you to define your terms. Since you haven't, I will continue to use generally accepted definitions.

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Does this mean they are more likely to be left-wing authoritarians, or does it show that they are less likely to be right-wing authoritarians?

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There's pretty much no such thing as "Left-wing Authoritarianism".Go read The Authoritarians. You can take the RWA scale test yourself. I'd be interested to know what your score is.

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In addition, you've shown nothing, other than that education causes people to be less likely to believe in a literal Genesis account and more likely to accept something they were probably unfamiliar with before they began their education anyway”evolution.

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I freely acknowledged in my last post that beliefs about Genesis creation and evolution were only one measure of the effects of education on fundamentalism.But an important part of Christian Fundamentalism is the belief that the bible is literally true and inerrant, and in particular the account of Creation is literally true.More education reduces this particular Fundamentalist belief, therefore it can be said to reduce fundamentalism, in part at least.

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pro-life, pro-marriage, pro-chastity...my, my

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People who support abortion rights are not "anti-life".People who support gay marriage are not "anti-marriage".People who support sexual freedom are not "anti-chastity".That is the difference between fundamentalist and liberal.The liberal says, "I think people should be free to choose their own morality as long as it doesn't negatively affect others."The fundamentalist says, "I think my morality is the only correct one and anyone who thinks differently is evil/going to hell."

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Groups that preach a message of chastity IMO are being very moral, so long as they aren't legally forcing anyone's hand.

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I'd say that the only way such groups could teach chastity and be moral is if the also provide full disclosure during their presentations of the lack of effectiveness of their programs.

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How are we supposed to get the message of mutual respect across, when we keep acting like sex has no consequences that can't be dealt with?

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I really don't know who you think teaches this, but it certainly isn't groups like Planned Parenthood or other mainstream pro-legalized abortion/sex education organization. Edited by nator, : No reason given.

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So @ Schraf, can you tell me”in regards to the topic”how a liberal is less/more morally deteriorated than a religious fundamentalist?

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How do you define "morally deteriorated"?