You Guys Need to Communicate! (thoughts from an ex evangelical Christian)

Good. There is no God to be found in any Fundie sects. If it is not believable, then throw it away too. Yes. Religions, all religions are just a creation of Man. They can never be anything else.Don't worry. You have nothing to fear and a wonderful life ahead of you. Find what you can believe. It will serve you better than any God you do not believe in.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

You got a copy of that thar signature. LOLDid Jehovah use a pen or jess a stylus? Before he created geese, what type quill did He use?Come on Buz.Stop making folk laugh. Stop saying really stupid things like "It is the only scripture with Jehovah's signature on it's pages, over 6000 signatures, that is."You're just making Christians look stupid.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

That seems like a particularly stupid comment. Just what does he mean by that? Is he implying that because we speak out against the Cults of Ignorance that we are somehow sheltering them? Does he think that the Religious moderates somehow stop others from opposing scriptural literalism and religious violence?Sorry but that is simply a stupid assessment.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Really?What about truthlover, True Christian, arach, trixie, Ringo (although his belief or non-belief remains a question), cavediver, etc? If so he simply showed even greater stupidity by his choice of words. He cannot be unaware of all of the Episcopal Sites that speak out against such things or of all of the Progressive Christian sites.Does he mean we do not have Televangelists like the 700 Club? Well, true. We are not crooks. We do not just produce infomercials or base our Theology on making a profit off the gullible.Edited by jar, : appalin spallin

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Well let's parse one of his statements (Harris as quoted by Percy) That is simply a falsehood. Moderates do NOT make it taboo to criticize religious faith itself.I have NEVER criticized someone who is an Atheist for being an Atheist, nor have I ever said people should not say things that are critical of any holy book. And I am not unique. There are those like Bishop Spong who has even questioned the whole concept of Virgin Birth so critical analysis of holy books is not limited to those outside Theology. But I am not sure that moderates do make a virtue out of taking things on faith. My experience is that far from a virtue, things believed solely on faith are slightly disturbing. I would agree.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

LOLMisdirection and stupid comments in one paragraph. Perhaps a new high even for you.I did not say that the person was stupid, but that the statement was stupid.And of course I would say that anyone who says "only one book written by just plain men is the only source of inspiration", makes a stupid statement.But Buz carried it even further to assert that a particular Translation carried the signature.I'm sorry but all that shows is a little mind incapable of critical thought.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Really? Such as?

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Yet even here at EvC you have examples that falsify that assertion. Look at Trixie as an example.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Well, you may not like it, but unfortunately for your blanket statement, one example does falsify it.Sorry. Which simply shows how utterly ignorant you are about Christianity and even Roman Catholicism.Even Jesus doubted and questioned his beliefs. And the Roman Catholic Church also constantly tests items of belief and over time even Roman Catholic dogma changes.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

And just why have you shown that to be the case? Oh come on Schraf. Second grade? Get serious. LOL

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

I think Schraf bringing up the second grade as examples of brainwashing and indoctrination is just plain funny.The second grade is still a time of wonder, when kids should still believe in the tooth fairy, the easter bunny and Santa Claus.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Yeah, right. And let me tell you just how effective all such brainwashing really is.LOLPretty soon one of their "Very Best Friends" tells them there really isn't a Tooth Fairy and guess who they believe.The problem is not indoctrination in the second grade, or even the third, fourth, fifth or sixth grades.The problem is when young adults are sheltered away in societies where they do not get to question, and that is certainly not the Roman Catholic Church. I went to a Church school and most of the folk I knew also went to Church schools, Friends Academy and Loyola and Calvert and Boys Latin and the environment in all of those encouraged questioning beliefs, not simply accepting them. Because, just as with Santa and the Tooth Fairy, brainwashing at that age doesn't stick.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

And you seem to be ignoring the context of my posts. Schraf was specifically talking about the RCC and mainstream Christianity.I find it hard to believe that you somehow have missed all of my posts condemning and ridiculing the Josh McDowell conmen?Is that possible?

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Yet more misrepresentation.Too too funny.I have NOT said fundamentalism is a fringe movement and in fact have openly said that it is a growing and increasingly dangerous movement. Let's see if you can get your facts straight.You seem to be playing the classic Fundy shuffle, moving goal posts and palming the pea.The point is that indoctrination done in the second grade is relatively benign, I have spoken out constantly against the Josh McDowell conmen, will speak out against any such RCC conmen you bring to my attention.Edited by jar, : No reason given.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Too funny Crash. You are Crash.You said: And that was what I quoted and replied to. When you then quote you are simply continuing the classic fundamentalist tactic of misrepresentation and misdirection as you palm the pea.I never said that you claimed I had not spoken out except by your misrepresentation that I try to portray fundamentalism in America as a fringe movement as seen in this quote from you. Frankly, I try to speak out against all fundamentalist whether they are Christians, or like you, Atheists.Now this is heading far afield from the topic, but I believe it is important to point out that what you are attempting, and what Harris seems to be attempting, do not appear to be supported by facts.This exchange began with Schraf's assertion that the RCC discourages questioning. My experience has been that the Roman Catholics I have encountered have been quite the opposite, and the Jesuits in particular are know for questioning.It then devolved to a discussion of indoctrination in the second grade. I still contend that talking about indoctrination in the second grade is pretty silly, since experience shows that the vast majority of kids start questioning the answers pretty soon after that and their peers become a far greater influence than the parental or adult authorities. No matter how much we might wish kids continued to have the trust and wonder, the belief in Santa Claus of their youth, pretty soon they figure it out.If you wish to believe I have said other than that, fine.As to my reponse to the Topic, you can read it in Message 6.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion