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Author | Topic: Why was Adam exempt from the transgression when the transgression was disobedience? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Greatest I am Member (Idle past 304 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: |
Why was Adam exempt from the transgression when the transgression was disobedience?
"Let the women learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. For Adam was first formed, then Eve. And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression." (I Timothy 2:11-14) I think that Adam, not being deceived, was more culpable than Eve. Why then did God favor the guiltiest, Adam, with, --- he shall rule over you? Men rule over women? Why when men were not deceived but disobeyed? What was the transgression, --- if not a wise decision to choose knowledge and wisdom and shun immortality of the flesh, --- even if that were possible, --- and why was Adan not punished as hard as Eve when he was clearly more guilty? RegardsDL
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Greatest I am Member (Idle past 304 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: |
Tag
You have a point but if the talking serpent or Satan deceived Eve it was because God put it there to do just that. She could not fight the supernatural power that God used against he either through the snake or Satan. And further, after she ate she had both our human instincts as well as all the knowledge of good and evil, which is more like all the knowledge that can be known, as most everything is subject to good and evil, so she may have done the right thing. Right? Why leave Adam as bright as a brick? RegardsDL
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Greatest I am Member (Idle past 304 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: |
Omnivorous
Perhaps but I hope it is a more complicated reason than male ego. RegardsDL
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Greatest I am Member (Idle past 304 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: |
Jar
He was exempt from the transgression according to that quote. I do not know the how. I am asking the why? I do not like the way it is written because it sort of indicates that the transgression was being deceived and not the disobedience. I am French and you English might be able to straighten me out. RegardsDL
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Greatest I am Member (Idle past 304 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: |
NoNukes
Interesting take but the quote I put shows that Eve did not disobey and Adam did. Eve was deceived ad I guess that is forgiven. That's why I think she got the raw end of the deal. If two people rob a bank, the judge does not care who went in first. Your sexual reference is not biblical and I ignore it. RegardsDL
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Greatest I am Member (Idle past 304 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: |
Faith
The West does give women more equality than the East but we still have a long way to go till women have full equality. I agree that religious men are not the only one's to blame for women's oppression and that all societies are. But do not forget that the majority rules and the majority has been men in the Abrahamic religion in the West and Middle East. ---------------- That was an interesting quote you gave."By one man sin entered the world." Please compare it to this one and opine on which is wrong, mine or yours. Ecclesiasticus Chapter 25;24 Of the woman came the beginning of sin, and through her we all die. ""He had the authority and therefore the responsibility, besides also the greater sin because he wasn't deceived." I agree and stated that so why was he given the lesser punishment and rewarded with dominion over Eve? And why did God stupidly put Satan or a supernatural talking snake right there where Eve was? I have heard it was to test them but that would be stupid for an God to do when he already knows the outcome to everything. RegardsDL
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Greatest I am Member (Idle past 304 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: |
ringo
I do not care what God agrees with. I do care that you might agree given the story. I think Adam more culpable. Do you agree or not? RegardsDL
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Greatest I am Member (Idle past 304 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: |
1.61803
Thanks. Please see message 11. RegardsDL
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Greatest I am Member (Idle past 304 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: |
NoNukes
You are correct in that the serpent was not anything special. It could not talk and what made it irresistible that day would have been God's power either directly or through Satan being focus through it's speech and since we know that Satan was given the power to deceive the whole world, that Eve could not resist that power. That is why I say that Eve was innocent of everything. RegardsDL
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Greatest I am Member (Idle past 304 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: |
NoNukes
"As for Eve's subordinance, how does it compare to the pre-punishment state?" The myth shows Eve as a second thought who was created as Adams helpmeat. Whatever that is. Here is a list of synonyms. adjunct, adjutant, aid, aide, apprentice, assistant, coadjutor, deputy, helpmate, helper, lieutenant, mate, sidekick. After they ate, Adam was to rule over her and I read that as Eve being Adams slave and property as per Jewish tradition. As you can see, I do not agree that Adam's suffering might be considered more onerous by some measure. RegardsDL
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Greatest I am Member (Idle past 304 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: |
ringo
" Being deceived is no excuse." Not having the power to not be deceived by a supernatural entity is a perfect excuse that any judge would accept. If there could be anything supernatural that is. I reject your view completely due to that magic. RegardsDL
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Greatest I am Member (Idle past 304 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: |
ringo
"Neither Adam nor Eve had the power to not be deceived. They were either equally innocent or equally guilty." I agree but God says nothing in this myth of Adam being deceived. He does say he disobeyed. Both being able to be deceived says nothing to the premise that Eve could not possibly resist and should thus be innocent of any wrongdoing. RegardsDL
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Greatest I am Member (Idle past 304 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: |
NoNukes
"During the serpent incident, Eve wasn't very much help to Adam was she?" I think she was. Would you eat of the tree of knowledge or would you choose to live in ignorant bliss forever? Remember that they were to dumb to even know they were naked and were never to reproduce. I think Eve was a great help. I did not mention Adams consequences because I see his being master as being so much better than Eve being his slave. RegardsDL Edited by Greatest I am, : No reason given.
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Greatest I am Member (Idle past 304 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: |
Coyote
Many thanks for this interesting way of stating facts. RegardsD
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