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Author Topic:   Is purposeless torture moral?
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 88 of 106 (661509)
05-07-2012 9:05 AM
Reply to: Message 87 by Greatest I am
05-07-2012 7:39 AM


Not good enough.
Torture is immoral because I would not like it done to me.
This answer has already been shown to be insufficient. I'm pretty sure you would not like to be imprisoned for a crime, or fined for violating a traffic ordinance. Are those things immoral?

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
The apathy of the people is enough to make every statue leap from its pedestal and hasten the resurrection of the dead. William Lloyd Garrison

This message is a reply to:
 Message 87 by Greatest I am, posted 05-07-2012 7:39 AM Greatest I am has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 89 by frako, posted 05-07-2012 5:29 PM NoNukes has replied
 Message 95 by Greatest I am, posted 05-09-2012 4:07 PM NoNukes has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 90 of 106 (661558)
05-07-2012 7:33 PM
Reply to: Message 89 by frako
05-07-2012 5:29 PM


Re: Not good enough.
So if you brake a moral code turned to law you get punished.
So, do unto others as you would have them do unto you must be modified to include the possibility of deserved punishment. And has been pointed out, therein lies the route to relativism.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
The apathy of the people is enough to make every statue leap from its pedestal and hasten the resurrection of the dead. William Lloyd Garrison

This message is a reply to:
 Message 89 by frako, posted 05-07-2012 5:29 PM frako has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 92 by frako, posted 05-07-2012 7:42 PM NoNukes has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 93 of 106 (661561)
05-07-2012 8:28 PM
Reply to: Message 92 by frako
05-07-2012 7:42 PM


Re: Not good enough.
i might fight it in court but i would not call it immoral.
That's fine. I was trying to get a similar admission out of someone else.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
The apathy of the people is enough to make every statue leap from its pedestal and hasten the resurrection of the dead. William Lloyd Garrison

This message is a reply to:
 Message 92 by frako, posted 05-07-2012 7:42 PM frako has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 97 of 106 (661749)
05-09-2012 6:24 PM
Reply to: Message 95 by Greatest I am
05-09-2012 4:07 PM


Re: Not good enough.
Torture is not usually such. Torture is usually done to extract information.
Torture need not be applied for the purpose of extracting information. For example, burning at the stake to be a torturous death even if the death itself can be justified as punishment.
But in any event, your own version of do unto others seems to include accepting unpleasant things if you deserve them. That's what turns the golden rule into a relativism. As has been pointed out repeatedly, all one needs to add is a justification, and any act can be considered moral.
Where? I was asked for my view and it is quite sufficient to me.
You cannot avoid the fact that your "view" has been addressed and refuted simply because you don't acknowledge such. You know full well, "where"
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
The apathy of the people is enough to make every statue leap from its pedestal and hasten the resurrection of the dead. William Lloyd Garrison

This message is a reply to:
 Message 95 by Greatest I am, posted 05-09-2012 4:07 PM Greatest I am has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 102 by Greatest I am, posted 05-10-2012 10:36 AM NoNukes has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 103 of 106 (661815)
05-10-2012 1:58 PM
Reply to: Message 102 by Greatest I am
05-10-2012 10:36 AM


Re: Not good enough.
Call it what you will. The bottom line is that reciprocity is fair play.
That was the conclusion of the person torturing to save lives.
If his peers agree then it was moral.
Morality by popular vote? Surely you jest.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
The apathy of the people is enough to make every statue leap from its pedestal and hasten the resurrection of the dead. William Lloyd Garrison

This message is a reply to:
 Message 102 by Greatest I am, posted 05-10-2012 10:36 AM Greatest I am has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 104 by Greatest I am, posted 05-11-2012 2:42 PM NoNukes has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 106 of 106 (662247)
05-14-2012 2:06 AM
Reply to: Message 104 by Greatest I am
05-11-2012 2:42 PM


Re: Not good enough.
The majority would agree that it is better and more moral to kill or torture one to save many.
Do you agree?
Or should the many just be left to die?
So if many people needed to steal food from me, so they could live while my small family dies, that would be moral in your opinion.
Nonsense.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
The apathy of the people is enough to make every statue leap from its pedestal and hasten the resurrection of the dead. William Lloyd Garrison

This message is a reply to:
 Message 104 by Greatest I am, posted 05-11-2012 2:42 PM Greatest I am has not replied

  
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