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Member (Idle past 1435 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
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Author | Topic: Who designed the ID designer(s)? | |||||||||||||||||||||||
New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
RAZD writes: Hi Catholic Scientist,
Assuming he did have a valid deduction for a god, ... Especially if he has that evidence via the deduction. Point 1: he doesn't. I looked at the video, and it defines what is seen to be intelligent and then concludes that because it is intelligent that it must be due to a designer. There was nothing there about a prediction. Point 2: getting from discovering intelligence in the world to a designer is a big leap of faith, getting from that designer to the god of the bible is another big leap of faith. Point 3: logic is not fact\evidence, and logic alone is not enough to be a scientifically valid conclusion (no matter how much some would like it to be). Especially bad logic. Enjoy. Think about it this way: Faith is a personnal experience that only the individual knows if they're employing or not. If someone was convinced by some thing that an Intelligent Designer exists, and they were not employing faith in their maintanence of the belief that the designer exists, then they are not taking the designer on faith. Regardless of how good their evidence is, or if you can make their argument look like a statement of faith, it really comes down to how they've come to accept the belief. You know what I mean?
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Straggler Member (Idle past 96 days) Posts: 10333 From: London England Joined: |
I think a lot of people who are not theistic or religious and who don’t have ‘faith’ are quite willing to accept the idea of an intelligent designer (in the broad as opposed to the specifically Christian fundamentalist sense of the phrase). Lots of people I know who don’t give the sort of topics considered at EvC much consideration at all subscribe to a sort of vague form of intelligent design on the simple basis that they think the world is just too ordered to be completely random.
You know what I think of such arguments. I would say that they haven’t really thought through the problems with that position. But if they are not interested in analysing the question particularly deeply and the simple fact of order in the world leads them to that conclusion then I don’t think ‘faith’ is an entirely appropriate description. In short — I think I agree with you on this.
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
In short — I think I agree with you on this.
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Straggler Member (Idle past 96 days) Posts: 10333 From: London England Joined: |
You've let yourself go since you last posted a picture of yourself here.
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intellen Member (Idle past 4386 days) Posts: 73 Joined: |
Thank you for your reply.
Yes, I had redefined the word "intelligence" since it is the only way for us in science to explain natural world. And I proved it in my video series in video 3 and video 5 and video 22. No one had ever defined intelligence scientifically. I knew that you will never see them but since I've already put them in Youtube, I think that it is good that you must look at them. They are all boring but if u know the contents, I think u will agree with me. Edited by intellen, : No reason given. Nothing makes sense in science except in the light of the new Intelligent Design .
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intellen Member (Idle past 4386 days) Posts: 73 Joined: |
Dr Adequate writes:
My English grammar maybe not good, but not my discoveries. The intellectual force of your argument is equaled only by its lucidity of expression. Nothing makes sense in science except in the light of the new Intelligent Design .
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Straggler Member (Idle past 96 days) Posts: 10333 From: London England Joined: |
So would you say that your belief in Intelligent Design is faith based or evidence based?
Or is it a combination of the two? And if so where do you think the faith ends and belief in the validity of the evidence begins? Do they overlap? Would your faith allow you to see evidence any other way?
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intellen Member (Idle past 4386 days) Posts: 73 Joined: |
Percy writes: Hi Intellen, welcome to EvC! It would help a great deal if you would make your arguments from scratch here in messages and just use links to webpages and videos as supporting references. You definitely do not want to leave the key parts of your arguments out of your messages. I at first thought your message made no sense because you began your arguments at item 8 and left out what came before, causing the two items by themselves to read like nonsense. But after viewing your video I see that all you did was copy the text of slide 8 and slide 9 into your message. Some comments about your video:
About Video 6 which you say should be watched first, it appears to be a collection of unrelated and unsupported assertions that do not make much sense. For example, you say that your experiment with the egg and tissue paper (which is described in neither slide presentation) shows that the one object destroys and the other object supports, and that this means a natural process has no opposing sides, just one side. You need to explain yourself a bit more, because what you say in the slide presentation makes no sense. --Percy 1. Yeah, OK.2. Actually, that was my manuscript when I submit to NATURE PRECEDINGS. I've just broken them piece by piece so that they could be understood. 3. My discoveries pinpoint Jesus Christ as the Intelligent Designer. So the background music is consistent with that presentation. 4. Thank you for this. My videos are put in a series. So I had to remind those watchers who watch in the middle so that they could understand the new Intelligent Design 5. OK, thank you. 6. I described it in video 3, 5, 22. To make it simple, I'll write it here: intellen = problem/solution + solution + solutionnaturen = event or let us make it clear intellen = life + defense mechanism + sensory systemnaturen = life + NO defense mechanism + NO sensory system 7. OK, in context of my discovery, the definition for the principle of intelligence is the principle of how an object or event or phenomenon is being made.8. OK, thank you. But that is what I've found. Since intelligence follows opposite phenomena, then, I think that is the best explanation to describe natural phenomenon. What is the best phrase? Can you tell me? 9. OK thank you. Yes, my experiment tells me, and in reality too, that intellen follows an opposite sides this is problem/solution.. a symmetry. But we know that a symmetry is an opposites, two sides. My experiment also tells me that intellen (with importance) is an asymmetry. It will look like this: problem/solution+solution+solution+... (more solutions than problem) So, we can easily conclude that naturen is not symmetry nor asymmetry. That means, nature has only one side. This is true. For example, if an earthquake occurs, then, it has no problem nor solution, for nature has no problem, nor solution. We define nature as neutral. Edited by intellen, : No reason given. Nothing makes sense in science except in the light of the new Intelligent Design .
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intellen Member (Idle past 4386 days) Posts: 73 Joined: |
Straggler writes:
The new Intelligent Design is an evidence based since we can easily test it and falsify it. I conducted my experiment AFTER I've become a Christian. But I did the findings in scientific way. So would you say that your belief in Intelligent Design is faith based or evidence based? Or is it a combination of the two? And if so where do you think the faith ends and belief in the validity of the evidence begins? Do they overlap? Would your faith allow you to see evidence any other way? Faith is more than science since it requires everything from a person. Edited by intellen, : No reason given. Nothing makes sense in science except in the light of the new Intelligent Design .
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intellen Member (Idle past 4386 days) Posts: 73 Joined: |
RAZD writes: Hi Catholic Scientist,
Assuming he did have a valid deduction for a god, ... Especially if he has that evidence via the deduction. Point 1: he doesn't. I looked at the video, and it defines what is seen to be intelligent and then concludes that because it is intelligent that it must be due to a designer. There was nothing there about a prediction. Point 2: getting from discovering intelligence in the world to a designer is a big leap of faith, getting from that designer to the god of the bible is another big leap of faith. Point 3: logic is not fact\evidence, and logic alone is not enough to be a scientifically valid conclusion (no matter how much some would like it to be). Especially bad logic. Enjoy. 1. My new discoveries had predictions. There are almost, I think, seven and counting. 2. My discoveries are not big leap of faith since everybody could test and falsify them. No one had ever defined "intelligence" scientifically and set boundary line between natural to intelligent. Even our best scientists today could never do that. 3. Yes, logic is not everything. That is why I had experiment, arguments and definitions. Edited by intellen, : No reason given. Nothing makes sense in science except in the light of the new Intelligent Design .
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jar Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Please place Jesus Christ in the lab so that we can test the designer and the method he uses to influence or direct biological design.
Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
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intellen Member (Idle past 4386 days) Posts: 73 Joined: |
jar writes:
That is impossible since, by definition, He is God, therefore, that is impossible. Unless you can easily manipulate Him. But the good is that our science is telling us that in nature, God really exist. This was proven by naturalistic methodology in science. Why can't u accept it? Because of ur religion or what? Please place Jesus Christ in the lab so that we can test the designer and the method he uses to influence or direct biological design. Nothing makes sense in science except in the light of the new Intelligent Design .
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jar Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
intellen writes: jar writes:
That is impossible since, by definition, He is God, therefore, that is impossible. Unless you can easily manipulate Him. But the good is that our science is telling us that in nature, God really exist. This was proven by naturalistic methodology in science. Why can't u accept it? Because of ur religion or what? Please place Jesus Christ in the lab so that we can test the designer and the method he uses to influence or direct biological design. Sorry but until you place Jesus on the lab table to test you have nothing but unsupported assertions. Come back when you have some evidence. Thank you for playing. Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
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intellen Member (Idle past 4386 days) Posts: 73 Joined: |
jar writes: intellen writes: jar writes:
That is impossible since, by definition, He is God, therefore, that is impossible. Unless you can easily manipulate Him. But the good is that our science is telling us that in nature, God really exist. This was proven by naturalistic methodology in science. Why can't u accept it? Because of ur religion or what? Please place Jesus Christ in the lab so that we can test the designer and the method he uses to influence or direct biological design. Sorry but until you place Jesus on the lab table to test you have nothing but unsupported assertions. Come back when you have some evidence. Thank you for playing. Now u r making a demand that is impossible. You are not making science now. You are already making religion. Then, we cannot agree. I talked science, u talked ur religion. Nothing makes sense in science except in the light of the new Intelligent Design .
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jar Member (Idle past 424 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
I talk no religion, you are the one claiming Jesus is the designer.
Now put him on the table so we can test your assertion. Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
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