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Author Topic:   "Macro" vs "Micro" genetic "kind" mechanism?
arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1374 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 10 of 248 (122028)
07-05-2004 4:39 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by RAZD
06-23-2004 11:33 PM


IF the concept of "kinds" is correct, THEN there must be mechanism(s) in the DNA that allows "micro"evolution but prevents "macro"evolution?
simple!
god does it!
actually, i've wanted to know the creationist answer to this for a long time. it tend to phrase it as "what stops little changes from adding up?" but it makes more sense this way.
seeing as how there is so little difference between us and chimps genetically. and remarkably little difference between chimps and bananas, genetically. it really only takes little changes.

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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1374 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 12 of 248 (122045)
07-05-2004 5:53 AM
Reply to: Message 11 by Mammuthus
07-05-2004 5:49 AM


well, yeah, but the question is asking for evidence of the actual mechanism that allows one kind of change but not the other, while preventing little changes from adding up.

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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1374 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 14 of 248 (122189)
07-05-2004 4:56 PM
Reply to: Message 13 by RAZD
07-05-2004 4:30 PM


Re: heh
honestly, i've never understood exactly why creationists are set against evolution.

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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1374 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 22 of 248 (122232)
07-05-2004 8:17 PM
Reply to: Message 15 by coffee_addict
07-05-2004 5:28 PM


Re: heh
Just think back in history. Everything that fundies have done in the past have always been something that puts the human species in the center of "creation". If we have a common ancestor with a dog or cat, it kinda defeats the purpose of humans being god's favorite.
i don't see how.
and us in the center of creation? isn't pride one of big sins christianity likes to rant against?
This message has been edited by Arachnophilia, 07-05-2004 07:17 PM

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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1374 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 24 of 248 (122234)
07-05-2004 8:20 PM
Reply to: Message 21 by jar
07-05-2004 7:48 PM


Re: Just a favor if you please...
stop using Christian and Creationist as though they were synonymous. It comes up time aftertime in thread after thread.
Most Christians have no problems with Evolution, Micro, Macro or anywhere inbetween. Those of us here who are Christian and also support the TOE have as hard a time understanding the mind or thought of the Literalists as you folk do. From Atheism to Zoology, those folk are in a little world of their own.
i agree totally, as a christian "evolutionist"
how many of us are there here, out of curiosity?

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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1374 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 64 of 248 (122521)
07-06-2004 10:40 PM
Reply to: Message 63 by RAZD
07-06-2004 10:25 PM


Re: Limits to Humans?
i don't think they're common enough now, or common at all long enough to have effected much of anything.

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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1374 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 86 of 248 (123921)
07-12-2004 10:53 AM
Reply to: Message 82 by pink sasquatch
07-12-2004 12:48 AM


lesbian lizards
Rrhain - I think it was you that mentioned "lesbian" lizards in one of the many homosexuality threads - all female but reproducing sexually.
nope, that was me. the lizards are the desert grassland whiptail, cnemidophorus uniparens.
Are they really more like hermaphrodites?
nope. they contain only female genitalia. the process used to trigger reproduction is sexual, lizard to lizard genital contact, but the actual reproduction is technically asexual. they're cloners. all of the lizards in the population share exactly the same genes, apparently.
Is it known if they have the equivalent of sex chromosomes?
yes. they're all female.
Would "unisexual" be an apt term for their reproduction?
yup. "parthenogenetic unisexual pseudocopulators" is what they're called. basically, in english, it means they're virgin-birthing one-sexed mutual-masturbators.
here's a link: nerve.com®
as a side note, what bugs me about them isn't the lesbian sex, but asexual reproduction it triggers. these lizards don't exactly have a gene pool, per se. they're all clones, exactly alike genetically. basically, evolution has stopped for these lizards. if something were to come along that would endanger them, they'd all be gone, because natural selection for them is all or nothing. they have no way to adapt.
This message has been edited by Arachnophilia, 07-12-2004 09:53 AM

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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1374 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 89 of 248 (123940)
07-12-2004 12:29 PM
Reply to: Message 88 by Mammuthus
07-12-2004 11:53 AM


Re: lesbian lizards
i knew i was missing something. i suppose random mutation and genetic drift through transcription errors are still in play. i should stop posting on no sleep, i must sound like an idiot lol.
although, i would imagine it still does leave them especially susceptable to extinction.

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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1374 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 95 of 248 (124192)
07-13-2004 5:56 AM
Reply to: Message 94 by Mammuthus
07-13-2004 4:13 AM


Re: lesbian lizards
I certainly was not trying to imply that you sound like an idiot..hope it did not come across that way.
nah, i've just gotten about three hours of sleep in the last three days. i'm not even tired anymore. so i occasionally miss stuff here and there.
i'm kind of curious though how a species evolves into a situation like the whiptail's. any ideas?

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