Exodus Part Two: Population of the Exodus Group.

going a little off topic here but are there ANY creationists/Christians in this forum at all? cuz i only see answers from Evolutionists

well i wasnt talkin about this topic, i was merely thinking of how many people here dont support the bible and are still christians, the center of the bible is christ yet you people throw the bible away and pick what you want to be truth

but let me propose something, what if the entire bible was inerrantly the word of God, entirely?then let me propose something else too, we are born in this world and die in this world, we know only of this world and ITS truths, what makes you think that if a Being greater than us would be overpowered by our miniscule intelligence created by this world? i am to say what IF the bible was word for word inspired by God (who has truths that YOU cannot possibly fathom) what makes you think that this is not TRUTH? tossing aside your Earthly beliefs to be logic. Earth logic and God logic are different, Logic to him is greater than Logic to you is. Remember God can put a camel through the eye of a needle, why cant every fact in Exodus be true? because you use the EARTH laws and logic to pick at the bible, but the bible wasnt created by MAN it was created by GOD someoen who doesnt FALL in the logic of man, another reason why for over 2000 years its STILL being discussed about. WHY? because we are going in circles, enter a deeeep forest without a compass you get lost instantly and never find your way back. thats what we are doing when we pick at the bible, we are trying to find our way out of the forest by looking at the ground, it would never happen that way.Edited by Juraikken, : No reason given.

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Then God is not very bright or capable of keeping his story straight.

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OK. so let me get this, your looking at the bible and analyzing it with your human logic. but its not human logic it is divinely logical. being "bright" to you is the maximum capacity of a human being, but God is not Bright, he is greater THAN bright no HUMAN can word.

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It could be if God is Loki the Trickster and is just out to fool folk by then faking all the physical evidence available.

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But I don't happen to think that God is just some little trickster out to fool folk.

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i dont either lol. but you have entered into this subject a very incorrect term. "all the physical evidence" now look, God cannot be proven through physical evidence, so why propose physical evidence for this? its wrong. like i said you pick and chose what to act upon, if you wish to use Physical evidence for Exodus then use physical evidence for God. dont pick on things you CAN prove wrong and ignore others you cant.My point is also that physical evidence is not facts because for all you know the facts that you have can be wrong, God can make it all wrong, he can make Carbon dates wrong JUST so you would go to God through faith alone. thats why its so difficult to believe in him, why? cuz he makes everything else seem so believable, THAT is the way to truth, so that YOU would look through all the fakeness of today and find God through FAITH alone.

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Come on. There isn't even one Bible. And all of it was just written by Man, edited by men, compiled by men, redacted by men. Further it was men who made the various decisions about what books would be in the Bible and even there, they could not agree. The smallest Canon has only 5 books while the largest Canon has over eighty.

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And you are partially right, the Bible is nothing but a Map, it is not the Territory, and like any Map the wise traveler tests the Map against reality and where the Map is wrong, trusts the truth of reality, the actual Territory.

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The Exodus story as told in the Bible simply is not supported by the physical evidence.

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written by man but inspired by God, is Moses to not believe the bush because it WASNT GOD? no God spoke to him THROUGH the bush. same with the bible God teached us THROUGH the people who wrote the bible. Yes i admit the bible was compiled by men, but how long did it take, tell me that. and HOW did they compile it? these people had knowledge of the Faith and knowledge of the people who ACTUALLY wrote it to the extent more than any christian scolar today, they took countless months to bring about the truth from teh incorrect. just cuz tehy took out some books doesnt mean its not truth now, what they took out was people who didnt like what Jesus did, or even God. Take the Gospel of Judas for example, he made a book that made him the hero! why? cuz he didnt like Jesus cuz Jesus said he betrayed him.Compiled by men who worked tediously to put the true bible that had been lost in array among fakes, together.but honestly are you to say that the people who created the bible without the inspiration of God are the most intelligent people on earth? you know why i say this? because it is STILL being discussed abotu and ALL arguments stay in a standstill. i am not to say that the one thing that causes wars and arguments for over 2000 years is MAN MADE, because man is not that smart. if man is SO smart then why does teh bible have a great longevity among men? among analysts, among criticizers, among all people? how is it that this thing has lived SO long and still has not neither won nor lost? it is not human.

God is not a trickster, because God never said "what you find on earth IS facts" he never said that! WE say that, cuz we think THEY are facts! lolhe is not tricking you when he creates teh false world, and NEVER says that what you see is FACTS!!!!! lol

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How silly. Come on. If the Exodus was something that really happened it would leave physical evidence. That is why you use physical evidence to test the story's accuracy.

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GOD is by definition supernatural. Since GOD is not natural, you cannot use physical evidence to test for the existence of GOD.

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see? but then we go into this "physical evidence" that we think is to be truth again. what makes you think the physocal evidence you have in your hands is the absolute truth? you cant, all you can say is "this is the best i got" your argument stands on ANY other subject but cant hold water with a supernatural subject of God intervening with something.so true, God is not natural. but whats to say that what took place in Exodus IS natural? the burning bush isnt natural but Moses going to Egypt is, the separation of the waters isnt natural but Moses being taken in by pharaoh IS, so what gives US the power to discern what is truth and fallacy? have YOU been there when it was made? noSO, the bible is... "then best i got" it is what it says it is becuase its all you have.

i never said survive physically i mean that the bible is the MOST debated subject, the MOST controvercial, the MOST war beginning subject, the MOST problematic.everything else is there yes, but, they are not causing this much trouble why? cuz the probably dont pose a good enough threat or whatever to be up there with the rest. ONLY christianity is the most debatable religion/belief/whatever you want to call it.i agree with you but thats not what i meant

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By creating something false, that looks real, he is creating a lie. Your description of god is that of a liar.

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when the fake world looks real to you its not his fault, you presume its real when he never said it is!

He is not lying, He said "I am your God and believe what i say" and when you turn from him and believe what YOU want to believe then its false!God never said that what you find on earth would be truth! he says HE is the truth. Jesus said he is the truth, the light, and the way. he also says the world HATED him before they hate us! and he says he is not OF the world so they hate him! so what did he do there? he separated himself from the world! meaning the Truth is separated from the WORLD! the world=wrong! Jesus=truth! Listen to Jesus NOT the world and you woudl get the right answer

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Huh? Supposedly it was real people involved, real Hebrews and real Egyptians.

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Sorry, that is natural.

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then what are you saying that is NOT physically accurate or whatever?

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Nonsense. We have LOTS of evidence from the period. We have actual letters and memos from folk living at the time that were in the area, and never noticed anything going on.

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What doesn't exist is any evidence of Hebrews living in Egypt at the time, that none of the things that would have HAD to have happened did. For example, none of the surrounding super powers of the day noticed that Egypt lost a Pharaoh or an Army. There was no rebuilding of materials supposedly lost such as horses, chariots, weapons.

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Physical events leave physical traces, and the Exodus like the Flood, like the Conquest of Canaan simply do not show up.

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ok those memos can be compromised because of Pharoh, you dont know that nothing REALLY happened. you know that maybe pharaoh wanted to cover it all up because he was ashamed of the whole ordeal? have u ever thought of that?other super powers could be compromised, dont u think Egypt is wealthy enough to do? YOU have no facts to state that they werent compromised at all! and becuase you dont have facts but what you find on the ground you believe that to be truth! but, it can be the opposite! it happens everyday.physical evidence of the charriots i can argue with because they say that they had found a charriot wheel at the bottom of that place and that there was an object at the edge of the red sea explaining the whole incident. and plus sinse when would the losers admit defeat so rationally? ESPECIALLY during those times.

ok good some intelligence.i could say the same for evolution and science, yet everyone in the world look at science as COMPLETE and absolute fact!That's why Christianity is a BELIEF. i do not think it is an illusion because everything makes perfect sense with what God says and it makes no sense with what Evolution says. i BELIEVE that. and i am entitled to that belief.

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So, why might not your reading of the Bible's meaning be the illusion?

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how is it an illusion can you elaborate

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Say, you're driving down a road and you're approaching a river. Your road map indicates there's a bridge across the river, but you do not see any bridge in front of you, but rather only river. Are you going to continue to drive, thinking "the map says there's a bridge there, therefore there must be a bridge there"?

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you do that everyday by putting faith in plenty of things in your life, you put faith in your car to not explode out of nowhere, you put faith in your president, you put faith in your nearby gas-station owner to lower his price.....etc. you put faith in a lot of things you dont realize. so basically you ARE trusting the map a lot of the times becuase you dont have a choice. you CANT stop having faith in your car because you need it, you CANT stop having faith in your president because you need a president.so? which is it? use your gut and go a different direction and not have faith in a map or go through. if you chose to leave faith then leave it all becuase the way your saying things you and me are both living blindly believing in our cars to not explode.but hold on, wait a minute. this MAP was written by people, hmm and people can be wrong sometimes, SO people cant be trusted as much. the Bible on the other hand was made by God, who cannot be wrong. SO i would believe a MAP made by God over a Map made by humans. and plus, the bible is right there, read it, analyze it, its open for that, but not a lot of things out there are open to analyze, you cant analyze your president personally, your FORCED to believe in him/her. its your choice to analyze the bible, if it were man made you woudlnt have that choice as well becuase the person who wrote it would NOT want its wrongs to be revealed and would give the bible to only a select few who would be compromised and BAM! BUTTTT it is in the hands of EVERYONE meaning, what is the creater to hide? NOTHING. every man made thing has its limits to your curiosity, why? cuz their wrongs dont want to be realized.The bible, was NOT man made, it was Godly made.

ok heres the deal, ANYTHING can be hidden....? anything. if Pharoh wanted it to never exist he can make that possible, what if neighboring countries didnt even HAVE A CLUE what happened? why wouldnt they know? cuz it was hidden. new recruits? why? meh cuz the old ones died of starvation and or went on vacation.ANYTHING can be hidden if you think about it and can be left without a trace!evidence? how can you have evidence when they can get rid of it! lets just say that they DID have the papers for new people bla bla bla, they can burn it and YOU today would not have any evidence.it CAN be done. but wait, its crazy how YOU are looking for absolute proof on this subject yet when the table turns about the big bang or the beginning of the world, even when there is no physical proof, it is udnoubtedly true!

what may i ask IS physical evidence your looking for? foutprints from over 3000 years ago? What?! lol

none of you guys even consider the fact that there could be a conspiracy, you think that if they are to HIDE those kind of things that maybe just maybe people would go through that land and CLEAN up all the mess the jews left behind?you wont even consider that i dont understand why! poop? cleaned up, human bodies? cleaned up, animals? cleaned up, charriots? cleaned up!evidence for hebrews living in Egypt? cleaned up!is that impossible? not considering how looking back at our history there are a lot of instances when things that happen were hidden from society and they would never find out until a long time after.

doesnt stand toexamination only cuz most people dont want the conspiracy...if i walk through a forest with my bags of food and etc. while i walk i clean my footprints so no one would follow me, i sit down to eat at night, make campfire, get water etc.i can clean up my mess to make it look like no one was there, i could put out the fire, scatter the wood, erase my tracs, then keep going.another person comes through the forest and think they are alone. is that impossible? no, what if Moses told them to do just that? to clean up after themselves and leave not a trace? of course this would take some time to do but God did evade the Egyptians.and plus out in the desert its easy to clean up after yourselves, just one look back and you can spot whatever you missed, go back and get it. these people were poor, so they wont waste ANYTHING they had, they wouldnt leave behind pans, cuz they dont have money to buy new ones. think about it.

becuase the egyptians left right after the Jews left and so they knew were they were going? good point but then how come there isnt a problem of Sodom and Gomorra being burned? or is that another issue well i mean yeah but...its possible to not scratch the rocks i mean tons of people go through places and not scratch the rocks i mean if they were LIVING there then yeah, but if they just passed through then it wouldnt be noticeable and i think the geographics of the lands change, rocks get buried, destroyed etc.

ok the flood left evidence yet that is not proof for you guys, so whatever i say wont be proof anyway.and if i go to virginia right now would i noticed debrees left behind from the english coming over?or better yet, cleaning up doesnt necessarily have to leave evidence i mean if Hitler was smarter than he actually was (which was prety smart) he coulda massacred the Jews and left no trace. even MOST of the German citizens didnt even know what was going on about the Jews, it was so secretive. if they can do it, so can the egyptians or the Jews