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Author | Topic: Any practical use for Universal Common Ancestor? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
RAZD Member (Idle past 1732 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
RAZD writes:
How do you falsify ToE? unlike the ToE which is falsifiable Several ways. This is an amusingly worn old PRATT. See Talk Origins Pratt ListClaim Claim CA211: quote: Finding a fossil that is out of place for the spacial/temporal matrix -- ie one that has no nearby parent populations in time and space to evolve from: a rabbit in the cambrian is a common example. Finding a genetic genome that doesn't fit the nested hierarchies predicted by evolution. Note that the perception that "Any fact can be fit into the theory of evolution" is due to all the known information/facts currently fitting the theory of evolution -- strong evidence that the theory is either correct or very near to correct. This gives us high confidence in the accuracy of the theory. Enjoy Edited by RAZD, : noteby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1732 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
RAZD writes:
Okay, so how do you falsify the theory that it doesn't appear to be falsifiable "Macroevolution = Microevolutions + Time" ? See Message 1160 Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1732 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined:
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Okay, let's simplify things - imagine that I decided to ditch my theory of aliens and like you, accepted Darwinism as the best scientific explanation for the fossil record. Although I accept Darwinism as the best scientific theory, I still wouldn't believe it, because In science we don't talk about believing theories, we talk about accepting them.
A. Accepting a scientific explanation as the best available at the time is not contingent on believing that explanation is the truth. For staters, I would be aware that the "best scientific explanation" today may not be the "best scientific explanation" tomorrow. Indeed, and that is why we talk about accepting the theory, tentatively, contingent on
B. I believe that a certain non-scientific explanation for the fossil record is a better explanation than the scientific one C. I believe the non-scientific explanation in B is the truth. You are free to believe whatever you like, however in science we deal with facts and objective empirical evidence rather than belief. Beliefs have a very poor record of altering or explaining reality, and are highly susceptible to individual bias. The problem with belief in the scientific world is with the (in)ability to change when evidence shows it is false, and if you don't discard false beliefs, in the face of evidence that it is false, it is known as delusion:
The fewer conflicts between your personal belief system and the objective empirical evidence of reality, the closer the personal belief system (world view) is to reality. This is the only known way to test the validity of beliefs that I am aware of. Enjoy Edited by RAZD, : . Edited by RAZD, : Fixedby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1732 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
The "replacement" level birth rate in ... Why is this a concern? The population in the US has doubled since I was in high school, so obviously there can be a reduction in population and still have a viable population. A larger concern is overpopulation and whether or not we develop a sustainable culture. In ecology one talks about the carrying capacity of an environment. Studies/observations show that populations over that capacity results in temporary overuse of needed resources, and that results in less resources available for individuals, and this subsequently causes a reduction of population. The result is swings in population sizes (unless species develop (evolve) ability to use alternate resources or they move to new (for them) environments that can support them). Interesting read on this topic: Hairston, Nelson G., Frederick E. Smith, and Lawrence B. Slobodkin. "Community Structure, Population Control, and Competition." The American Naturalist 94, no. 879 (1960): 421-25. JSTOR: Access Check. ... known as the "Why is the world green" paper. Short explanation on youtube
Disclaimer: Frederick E. Smith was my father. For confirmation, see Ecologists explain why the world is green quote: These implications holds for humans as well. History also shows that human cultures have consistently grown until the population is so large it overused resources and that resulted in loss of sustainable culture and subsequent collapse. Cultures rose, prospered and then collapsed. Interesting read on this topic: The Day Before America by William H. MacLeish:
quote: It's about native cultures before America was "discovered" and named by Columbus et al, their history from first post ice age explorers to the large cultures that covered these lands before the Europeans arrived.
... I can't find any "feminist" countries ... We are not immune to the needs of sustainable culture and ecological awareness instead of blind population growth. Forcing women to have more children will not solve that problem. Blaming any group of (biased) choice for general problems they have not caused is counterproductive and doesn't solve the problem. Blaming 'others' (scapegoating) for problems you (your culture) have caused doesn't solve them. Understanding the problem is the first step in solving it. In ecological/evolutionary terms this means developing a sustainable culture rather than one that grows blindly with inevitable consequences. Enjoy Edited by RAZD, : . Edited by RAZD, : added. Edited by RAZD, : .by our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1732 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined:
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(and Bellum has other meanings...) Do you have a auntie? Just askin ...by our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1732 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined:
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Do you realize that you can't address the examples of evolution being used in practical applications? Why is that? Cognitive dissonance. Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1732 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
... such as practical use in applied science for the Darwinian interpretation of the history of life on earth. It tells us who we are. Enjoyby our ability to understand RebelAmericanZenDeist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1732 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
I found evidence for your alien theory
Andrews McMeel Syndication - Home Non Sequitur by Wiley ![]() by our ability to understand RebelAmericanZenDeist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1732 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
RAZD writes:
Whatever that means and which has nothing to do with a practical use in applied science for the Darwinian explanation of the history of life on earth. It tells us who we are. Applied science (engineering essentially) is making use of knowledge to make practical things, like bridges and roads, but also medicines and foods. You've been told this already. Knowing who we are means not wasting a lot of time and bandwidth on fantasies but spending that time on actual works of value. It also means doing those things instead of waiting for magic fantasies to fix it. Enjoyby our ability to understand RebelAmericanZenDeist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1732 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
Whatever you still haven’t yet given me a practical use in applied science for the Darwinian interpretation of the history of life on earth. You missed it.
Btw, this is getting off-topic, but what does the Darwinian interpretation of the history of life on earth tell us about who we are? Maybe you should try to figure that one out. It's not rocket science. Enjoyby our ability to understand RebelAmericanZenDeist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1732 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
I didn't miss it. All you gave me was some irrelevant rhetoric, not a practical use. Try again. Ignoring the information by calling it "irrelevant rhetoric" shows you missed it.
God could have created life via a process of Darwinian evolution. ... Except the "process(es) of Darwinian evolution" don't create life, they just modify what is there.
... What does that tell us about "who we are"? See if you can figure that out here ... you have the relevant information. Call it an exercise in education. Enjoyby our ability to understand RebelAmericanZenDeist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1732 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
alternative fiction?
![]() by our ability to understand RebelAmericanZenDeist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1732 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
OOPS you dodged again ...
Be specific - give me a specific example of how the neo-Darwinian explanation for the history of life on earth has provided a practical use in applied science. It tells us who we are ...
... What does that tell us about "who we are"? See if you can figure that out here ... you have the relevant information. Call it an exercise in education. You have the all necessary relevant information. Enjoyby our ability to understand RebelAmericanZenDeist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1732 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
Uh huh, well that was the original statement of the conclusion. Later of course they managed to invent some other stuff based on a lot of mere verbiage, no actual evidence. The "original statement" was hired liar Barr's lying smoke screen statement about what was in the Mueller report. The original Mueller report listed several cases of probable obstruction of justice and said that they could not exonerate Trump of obstruction of justice, and that they could not prosecute a sitting president and that it was up to the congress to pursue. Of course you could read the Mueller report if you wanted the truth. You don't. You can't handle the truth. We have now seen several more cases of obstruction of justice by proven liar Trump. Enjoyby our ability to understand RebelAmericanZenDeist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1732 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined:
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Anyway, if synapsids DID evolve from amniotes it would have to be by microevolution which is not evolution but means they are really the same species. ... That's you all tied up by your denial. Microevolution IS evolution All evolution occurs within a living breeding population, within a species. What happens later ("Macroevolution") is just the observation that species continue to change (by "Microevolution") generation after generation, where the only limitations are survival and reproduction of the individuals living at that time, and of the population as a whole as it adapts to their changing environment/s.
... but means they are really the same species. ... At any one time the breeding species would - by definition - be all one species. The question here is whether or not they are the same as an ancestral species or have they changed to the point where it is useful to label them a new species. Unless we can clone ancestral species or find some isolate that has not changed significantly from the ancestral species it is rather difficult to determine inter breeding ability. Names are useful. For instance we can say that all chimps, gorillas, orangutans, and gibbons are apes (hominoids). But is it useful to talk about hominoids being democrat or republican, or is it more useful to use a name that is more restrictive in meaning so that we don't confuse the issue with whether or not chimp hominoids are politically inclined? And it is useful to identify groups of individuals by their common ancestry in the natural geological history to talk about their development within the geological/temporal matrix -- whether we use "species" or genus or family. This is a practical use of common ancestry.
... but means they are really the same species. ... By this mega-macro-lumping viewpoint all life is ultimately the same species ... because you can follow the historical lineage back, via fossils and DNA, to the first living species ... for every living thing on earth today. Plants and trees and algae and bacteria included.
... But it's evolution that is claimed, and that's nonsense. I looked up some images but my eyes don't work well enough to identify the relationship between the two creatures. Says the person who classifies all trilobites as one species, while at the same time saying that humans and chimps are not related by a common ancestor. In other words inconsistent irrational claims based solely on opinion/belief and ones inconsistent with the evidence. Your view is irrelevant because of the inconsistencies in your arguments. Enjoy Edited by RAZD, : .by our ability to understand RebelAmericanZenDeist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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