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Member (Idle past 178 days) Posts: 515 From: Tustin, California USA Joined: |
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Author | Topic: Chariots of God (Scripture & Photo Examined) | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 315 days) Posts: 16113 Joined:
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You do not even know what the Holy Spirit looks like. A dove. (Luke 3:22.)
How can you possibly determine that the photograph that I claim is the Holy Spirit in bodily form is not? How can you determine that this isn't a photograph of the Holy Spirit in bodily form? It looks just like it, unlike your picture which looks like out-of-focus dust.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 315 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
The Holy Spirit does not look like a dove. He merely descended as a dove would descend. That's not what the Bible says:
And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 315 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
He descended "like a dove". Not "as a dove". The Holy Spirit descended, as the Bible says, in the bodily shape of a dove. In the original Greek: "καὶ καταβῆναι τὸ Πνεῦμα τὸ Ἅγιον σωματικῷ εἴδει ὡς περιστερὰν ἐπ’ αὐτόν". Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given. Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 315 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
I still think that the Bible means what it says. 'Cos if it doesn't, then who knows what it means? If we ignore the actual words, the Gospel of Matthew might be about a happy little hippopotamus on a quest to find a cut-price hat shop.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 315 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
I knew that my answer would be way above your pay grade. And yet in the event your answer turned out to be shit. So that's something else you were wrong about.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 315 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
The Holy Spirit would not go around masquerading as a lowly dove. There are those who claim God became incarnate as a lowly carpenter's son. Pfft.
You misinterpret scripture. No, I just read it. "καὶ καταβῆναι τὸ Πνεῦμα τὸ Ἅγιον σωματικῷ εἴδει ὡς περιστερὰν ἐπ’ αὐτόν." This isn't interpretation, it's just translation: "And descended the Holy Spirit [lit. "the Spirit the Holy"] in a bodily form like a dove upon him."
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 315 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
There is no reason for the Holy Spirit to appear as a dove. If it wants to be visible, it has to look like something. Apparently, it went with a dove, a choice which has inspired artists and poets for two millennia.
You are misreading this piece of scripture. The Holy Spirit descended as a dove would have and the Holy Spirit was in bodily form at the time. Try reading it again. OK, I'll read it again. "καὶ καταβῆναι τὸ Πνεῦμα τὸ Ἅγιον σωματικῷ εἴδει ὡς περιστερὰν ἐπ’ αὐτόν." - "And descended the Holy Spirit [lit. "the Spirit the Holy"] in a bodily form like a dove upon him." That's just what it says. It doesn't say your thing. It says that.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 315 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
The Holy Ghost was in bodily form descending like a dove. This should clear it up for you. Mathew 3:16. When He had been baptized, Jesus came up immediately from the water, and behold, the heavens were opened to Him, and He saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and alighting upon Him. The Holy Spirit was in a bodily form like a dove. This should clear it up for you, but probably won't, because of that thing with your brain. Luke 3:22: "καὶ καταβῆναι τὸ Πνεῦμα τὸ Ἅγιον σωματικῷ εἴδει ὡς περιστερὰν ἐπ’ αὐτόν." - "And descended the Holy Spirit [lit. "the Spirit the Holy"] in a bodily form like a dove upon him."
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 315 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
I have seen the Holy Spirit many times and know that His bodily form is not a dove. Yes dear. That's nice.
Read Mathew 3:16 again and you will clearly see that He was "descending like a dove". Read Luke 3:22 and you'll find out that the Spirit was in the bodily form of a dove. Which would explain why it descended like a dove.
Your interpretation is inadequate. It is not an interpretation. It's the actual words. "σωματικῷ εἴδει ὡς περιστερὰν" - "in a bodily form like a dove". That's what the Bible says. But since you can't tell the difference between dust and the Holy Spirit, I'm not surprised you can't tell the difference between me and St. Luke.
You have failed. You must now go sit in the corner wearing your hat. As you are evidently a moron, it would be as well for you not to try to patronize people. Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 315 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
It is still above your pay grade (understanding). No. I understand exactly what "σωματικῷ εἴδει ὡς περιστερὰν" means. It means "in a bodily form like a dove". This is why people who are paid to translate Koine Greek translate it that way. Translating Greek is not above their pay grade. It is, however, above yours, isn't it?
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 315 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
You are taking your words out of context. Hey, halfwit. First of all, let me explain this again. I am not St. Luke. Second, the phrase "σωματικῷ εἴδει ὡς περιστερὰν" means "in a bodily form like a dove" in any given context. There is no conceivable context in which it means anything else.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 315 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
Read the full sentence again Dr. Adequate. "And descended the Holy Spirit n bodily form like a dove upon Him". It is a complete sentence. It expresses a single idea. Yes, it conveys the idea "And descended the Holy Spirit in a bodily form like a dove upon him." Do you admit now that this is what it says, and what it means?
Your problem is in understanding the written English language. Yes, I do that way too much for your taste. I also understand the Greek. And what I understand it as meaning is "And descended the Holy Spirit in a bodily form like a dove upon him." I do not understand it as meaning "And descended the Holy Spirit in a bodily form not like a dove upon him", because I am not a willful liar or a complete fucking moron.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 315 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
This is for ringo as well. John 14:10. the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. I agree that the Gospel of John says that. Do you agree that the Gospel of Luke says: "καὶ καταβῆναι τὸ Πνεῦμα τὸ Ἅγιον σωματικῷ εἴδει ὡς περιστερὰν ἐπ’ αὐτόν." - "And descended the Holy Spirit [lit. "the Spirit the Holy"] in a bodily form like a dove upon him."
A few can truly identify the Holy Spirit and notice His acts. I think we are ready to concede that you're a very special snowflake.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 315 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
You are in error. Very well, I retract my remark: you are not a very special snowflake.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 315 days) Posts: 16113 Joined:
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The only way the Holy Spirit can be identified is with the Bible. OK. Using the Bible, which of these is the Holy Spirit, and which are ... well, what are the others?
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