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Author Topic:   the insidious GMO threat (and it affects HFCS two ways ... )
Taq
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Message 16 of 115 (739937)
10-29-2014 6:20 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by RAZD
10-28-2014 12:20 PM


insidiously infiltrating into virtually all prepared foods in the US ...
The day we started selectively breeding cultivars they became GMO's. I don't see why we should draw an arbitrary line between selective breeding of new naturally occurring variants and directly manipulated genomes.

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Taq
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Posts: 10085
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.6


Message 18 of 115 (739939)
10-29-2014 6:26 PM
Reply to: Message 10 by RAZD
10-29-2014 11:42 AM


Retracted by the publishers under pressure from the GMO companies? Glyphosate based products are becoming increasingly scrutinized as being behind some pernicious effects on the overall ecology. Would you drink it?
Herbicides have been used for a long time, and with non-GMO foods.
IF these products are so gosh-darn safe, then why is there any resistance to GMO labeling of products -- shouldn't they be PROUD of their usage?
If vaccines really were safe, why would there be an anti-vaccine craze?

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Taq
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Posts: 10085
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.6


Message 27 of 115 (740003)
10-30-2014 6:38 PM
Reply to: Message 24 by Jon
10-30-2014 2:00 PM


Re: Not all GMOs are alike
If the crops are more resistant to pesticides, herbicides, and fertilizers, do we become more resistant by eating them?\
Is the resistance based on an internal change to the crop that cannot be transferred to humans or is it based on the inclusion of certain free chemicals in the crop that can flow freely in the human body as well?
Or am I just completely out of the zone of reality on this one?
Glyphosate resistance was first seen in wild populations, and they were able to find the gene responsible for the resistance in the wild populations. They took that gene from the wild populations and put it into the genomes of crop varieties.
Since you don't incorporate the genes of your food into your genome, I don't need to worry about becoming resistant to Roundup.

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Taq
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Posts: 10085
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.6


(1)
Message 28 of 115 (740005)
10-30-2014 6:44 PM
Reply to: Message 23 by xongsmith
10-30-2014 12:42 PM


Re: Not all GMOs are alike
Making a GMO resistant to your own company's patented herbicide, thereby allowing you to increase the use of it to kill off weeds around your GMO, does significantly add to the environmental impact.
Compared to what? The most significant impact that farming has is when the plow gets rid of the native ecosystem. Which herbicide you use after that point is a drop in the bucket. Roundup is actually one of the better herbicides.
The real lashback has been the shady behavior of Monsanto, such as linking the gene to a lethal marker (I think?) so that you can't raise your own seed stock of Roundup Ready crops. You have to keep going back to them for the seeds, and they aren't cheap.
On the "good" side, this GMO system works best if you rotate in Roundup sensitive crops so that the resistance doesn't build up in weed populations.

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Taq
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Posts: 10085
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.6


Message 35 of 115 (740055)
10-31-2014 11:19 AM
Reply to: Message 29 by NoNukes
10-30-2014 10:03 PM


Re: Not all GMOs are alike
quote:
I haven't heard this. In fact, what I have seen Monsanto do is sue farmers who save seed without paying Monsanto royalties on the basis that doing so infringes their patents.
That's another example. People hear the fervor against the corporate practices of Monsanto and that can bias their opinion on how safe GMO foods are, even though the two issues are completely unrelated.

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Taq
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Posts: 10085
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.6


Message 63 of 115 (740691)
11-06-2014 6:56 PM
Reply to: Message 57 by RAZD
11-06-2014 4:05 PM


Re: Not all GMOs are alike -- some include poisons inside the food
When the only variable is GMO corn or non-GMO corn, for example, I have a problem with studies claiming there is no cause for concern.
Why is there cause for concern to begin with?
If glyphosate resistance had evolved in corn, would you say that it is safe? Glyphosate resistance did evolve naturally in other species, and those genes were moved to corn. Why do you think this poses a threat?

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Taq
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Posts: 10085
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.6


Message 64 of 115 (740692)
11-06-2014 7:00 PM
Reply to: Message 61 by RAZD
11-06-2014 5:33 PM


Re: more of same
And I grew up with the Tobacco industry publishing all kinds of studies showing that their product was safe -- they were the big bad corporations before BigPharm and now BigAg.
Call me unreasonably skeptical if you must, but I see the same pattern being acted out here with GMOs.
That was non-GMO tobacco, wasn't it?
The risk of constantly inhaling a toxic smoke is quite obvious. I don't see the obvious risk with plants that we have been eating for generations.
We did not evolve to eat chemicals.
What in the world do you think plants and animals are made of? Happy thoughts and dreams?
Not quite what I was saying: the toxins kill the gut bacteria in the pest bugs and cause their guts to become leaky.
What toxins are you talking about?

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Taq
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Posts: 10085
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.6


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Message 105 of 115 (750938)
02-24-2015 12:09 PM
Reply to: Message 103 by Stile
02-24-2015 10:27 AM


Re: consensus or not?
GMOs are safe if done safely.
GMOs can be dangerous if not done safely.
How are GMO's any more of a threat than the plants themselves? How do we know that brocolli or brussel sprouts with their native genomes are safe? How do we know that naturally produced mutations that result in new phenotypes in cultivars are safe? How do we know if certain combinations of naturally occuring alleles are safe?
Let's not forget that the gene responsible for Roundup resistance evolved naturally. All they did was take that naturally evolved gene from one plant and put it in another.

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Taq
Member
Posts: 10085
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.6


Message 115 of 115 (751005)
02-25-2015 4:39 PM
Reply to: Message 108 by NoNukes
02-24-2015 2:03 PM


Re: consensus or not?
This is a bogus argument. The Roundup resistant gene was completely harmless in its original location. Who knows what the potential was in whatever part of the plant kingdom that you are speculating it might have been found in. There is simply no way to know whether its existence in other plants might have addressed whatever are the current concerns or whether its original source would have been irrelevant.
The very same thing could be said of naturally occuring mutations, and yet you aren't calling for anyone to test those. Why not?

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