When is a belief system a Mental Disorder?

Most cases of insanity have nothing to do with religion or belief in another dimension. I don't have a criterion to offer at the moment about how to break it down, but splitting the pie this way doesn't strike me as the way to go about it. Belief in another dimension, even hearing voices, can describe people both sane and insane.This message has been edited by Faith, 02-15-2006 09:09 AM

The topic is too disorganized it seems to me to admit of a coherent discussion. But I'll throw out some statements I think might apply.There is an invisible world of living beings. Believing in this is not in itself crazy. Every culture on earth has acknowledged such beings. Jesus had to deal with demons who had possessed people.Hearing voices may have many sources, including one's own mind, but there are real living beings who are capable of speaking to a person's mind in this way, so I wouldn't jump to conclusions about the person's mental state from this mere fact.These beings are considered by Christians to be malevolent, to be distrusted or ignored. They are the same beings who have pretended to be "gods" for various religions throughout the history of the world.I've believed since I became a Christian that they are probably the cause of the voices that the insane DO hear. Common ideas they may impart feed the person's sense of importance or they lead the person to self-destructive acts, or as in the case of the woman who killed her children, or "Son of Sam," to commit violence against others.The most standard Christian position is that we are not to heed ANYTHING but the word of God. God does "speak" to us but not as a voice, more as an impression on the conscience, and the God-taught conscience would condemn any impulse to murder.So although hearing voices isn't exactly a common event, if it should occur, the Christian's decision has to be based on what the Word of God says, not what the voice says. There is plenty of teaching through the millennia on this.So the woman who killed her children, who considered herself a Christian, was wrong by Christian standards. It wasn't God she heard from. I also think she was/is insane, but I don't know the legal criteria for establishing this.This message has been edited by Faith, 02-15-2006 09:34 AM

Yes. Most cultures throughout history have had such beliefs, and shamans or priests who practice healing or magic within the cultural context based on their contact with spirits.

I was thinking of the idea that others are plotting against them, or, like the mathematician of the movie "A Beautiful Mind," that they are involved in some extremely important covert operations. These beliefs rarely have anything to do with religion. OK. That's interesting. I wasn't aware of that. I also had a paranoid schizophrenic brother, who died by dousing himself with gasoline and lighting it. We think his voices had told him to do it but we'll never know. There was no religious content in any of his experiences.This message has been edited by Faith, 02-15-2006 09:59 AM

The still small voice isn't understood to be the kind of voices we are talking about, but something closer to an impression.However, the prophets of the Old Testament routinely heard directly from God, and in no uncertain terms. And Paul certainly heard from God in a very dramatic way.With the closing of the canon, however, most Christians believe all that kind of revelation -- revelation as to the nature of the faith itself -- ended. Believers continue to "hear" from God, however, in many forms, the most common being through the Bible's speaking a particular thought at a particular moment.

God never told an individual to kill anyone. The military operations of Israel are something else altogether.

Or it could be that if you look closer you'd recognize that it isn't about observed reality at all, but about an interpretation that is imposed upon reality, and that the wilful ignorance is to be found elsewhere.

Well, then your topic isn't quite what you are claiming it is. It is just your way of calling the opponents of old earth crazy without having to address the arguments themselves. Not a good one as the evidence in that case really is unchallengeable, and how many people are there who deny the reality of the dinosaurs anyway?This message has been edited by Faith, 02-15-2006 10:32 AM

And Coragyps gave a similar example. Too bad. Not crazy though. Your thread really is misnamed and misconceived I believe. Needs some rethinking.By the way, you haven't been here very long, unless I am mistaken, and I don't recall seeing you dealing with any of the actual arguments about the old earth. Have I missed this? Reread your OP, SNC, you ARE calling them crazy. Rather patronizing of you to post that.

That's what I thought. You haven't bothered.

I suggest that if you don't want this thread to become merely another debate on OE vs YE that you stay away from this topic as you just admitted you are running on nothing more than your own prejudice and haven't the grace even to read the threads related to the arguments.

I've already participated on many threads on the subject and yes I do believe your professors are wrong about the timescales. They are perfectly idiotic as a matter of fact. I believe that the evidence on the side of an old earth is restricted entirely to radiometric dating methods. There is no other objective evidence. And that evidence is open to question. If you haven't bothered to read the threads on it, there's not much point to discussing anything about "reality" with you.

Well, I DON'T read AIG. I've made my own case independently of any particular creationist system.

The TIMESCALES are perfectly idiotic, not your professors, who are merely deluded by the biggest scientific hoax ever conceived, quite understandable considering.

Yes, jar. Let me suggest that we be imprisoned in a dark dungeon. perhaps tortured on the rack. I understand that was very effective for getting people over their delusions. Or they died, but what the heck, win a few, lose a few.