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Author Topic:   We Need States
nwr
Member
Posts: 6412
From: Geneva, Illinois
Joined: 08-08-2005
Member Rating: 5.3


Message 2 of 63 (679210)
11-12-2012 11:00 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Jon
11-12-2012 10:51 PM


Jon writes:
We Need States
Yes, we need states.
Jon writes:
States are good.
I wouldn't go that far.
States have bloated bureaucracies and too much corruption. Perhaps not all states have those problems, but many do.

Fundamentalism - the anti-American, anti-Christian branch of American Christianity

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Jon, posted 11-12-2012 10:51 PM Jon has replied

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 Message 3 by Jon, posted 11-12-2012 11:02 PM nwr has seen this message but not replied

  
nwr
Member
Posts: 6412
From: Geneva, Illinois
Joined: 08-08-2005
Member Rating: 5.3


Message 12 of 63 (679335)
11-13-2012 11:52 AM
Reply to: Message 6 by crashfrog
11-13-2012 10:29 AM


crashfrog writes:
1) They lack natural purpose. Contra Jon, we don't need an additional level of bureaucracy between the local and national level because there is no such thing as an issue whose natural scope is, say, exactly no larger or smaller than a rectangular area the size of Wyoming.
State highways, state waterways.
crashfrog writes:
2) They breed legal confusion. Is it morally worse to murder a person in California than to murder that same person in Illinois?
3) They promote a race to the bottom.
Those are arguments about the scope of state government, rather than about the existence of state government.
crashfrog writes:
4) They're anti-democratic. The most powerful man in the Senate is Max Baucus, chair of the Senate Finance Committee and therefore in a position to unilaterally veto every piece of legislation in Congress.
Nonsense. That is a problem with senate rules, not with there being states.
I am better represented in Washington by my state's senators than I am by my representatives. At least senatorial districts cannot be gerrymandered.
crashfrog writes:
5) They're insufficient in scope. Perhaps as many as ten million Americans do not reside in any state, but because of the misapprehension that the United States is a nation of united states, these Americans have no representation in Congress, no ability to shape policy or express their legislative preference, but are nevertheless taxed to support the activities of the government that they have little electoral input into.
I'll grant that is a problem, but it could be resolved without eliminating the concept of states.

Fundamentalism - the anti-American, anti-Christian branch of American Christianity

This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by crashfrog, posted 11-13-2012 10:29 AM crashfrog has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 15 by crashfrog, posted 11-13-2012 2:52 PM nwr has seen this message but not replied

  
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