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Author Topic:   The slickest con ever perpetrated on mankind
shadow71
Member (Idle past 2963 days)
Posts: 706
From: Joliet, il, USA
Joined: 08-31-2010


Message 30 of 59 (662977)
05-20-2012 7:52 PM
Reply to: Message 25 by Coyote
05-20-2012 5:56 PM


Re: Thanks for the reply, but...
Coyote writes:
How about the promise of an afterlife as made by "religious practitioners" is the most "egregious swindle" ever perpetrated on mankind?
I assume you have some proof for that statement. As I have been told many times on this board. Show me the evidence that there is no afterlife.
Are you of the belief that Jesus was a Shaman?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 25 by Coyote, posted 05-20-2012 5:56 PM Coyote has not replied

  
shadow71
Member (Idle past 2963 days)
Posts: 706
From: Joliet, il, USA
Joined: 08-31-2010


Message 31 of 59 (662980)
05-20-2012 7:58 PM
Reply to: Message 23 by Granny Magda
05-20-2012 5:17 PM


Re: Thanks for the reply, but...
Granny Magda writes:
Personally, I would say that none of the various Christian sects is truly legitimate, since none of them is true. Certainly though, some are better or worse than others and those groups who are in the business of stripping the gullible of their cash are the lowest of the low.
I assume you have evidence that "none of the various Christian sects is truly legtimate."
Or is this your opinion elevated to the "truth", without the benefit of factual support?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 23 by Granny Magda, posted 05-20-2012 5:17 PM Granny Magda has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 34 by Granny Magda, posted 05-20-2012 8:11 PM shadow71 has replied

  
shadow71
Member (Idle past 2963 days)
Posts: 706
From: Joliet, il, USA
Joined: 08-31-2010


Message 33 of 59 (662984)
05-20-2012 8:06 PM
Reply to: Message 10 by Panda
05-19-2012 11:20 AM


Re: Thanks for the reply, but...
marc9000 writes:
coyote writes:
And are you suggesting that we don't have shamans (under different names) in our culture today?
Yes I am, if you can't name them.
panda writes:
Oh.
You are unaware of the existence of priests?
Unusual - but that kind of ignorance no longer surprises me.
Here is a link to some information about them: Priest - Wikipedia
Based upon your logic would you agree that Richard Dawkins is a Shaman when he preaches there is no afterlife?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 10 by Panda, posted 05-19-2012 11:20 AM Panda has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 36 by jar, posted 05-20-2012 8:21 PM shadow71 has replied

  
shadow71
Member (Idle past 2963 days)
Posts: 706
From: Joliet, il, USA
Joined: 08-31-2010


Message 35 of 59 (662988)
05-20-2012 8:16 PM
Reply to: Message 34 by Granny Magda
05-20-2012 8:11 PM


Re: Thanks for the reply, but...
Granny Magda writes:
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence and the various Christian sects provide no more evidence for their peculiar ideas than any other faith, which is to say, slim to none. To regard any sect as legitimate on such thin evidence would be illogical.
Would you accept the "Blessed Mother's" appearances at Fatima and Lourdes, among others ,extraordinary evidence?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 34 by Granny Magda, posted 05-20-2012 8:11 PM Granny Magda has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 38 by jar, posted 05-20-2012 8:23 PM shadow71 has seen this message but not replied
 Message 42 by Granny Magda, posted 05-21-2012 7:16 AM shadow71 has seen this message but not replied

  
shadow71
Member (Idle past 2963 days)
Posts: 706
From: Joliet, il, USA
Joined: 08-31-2010


Message 40 of 59 (662993)
05-20-2012 8:26 PM
Reply to: Message 36 by jar
05-20-2012 8:21 PM


Re: Thanks for the reply, but...
jar writes:
Re: Thanks for the reply, but...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Of course not.
What he says is that there is absolutely no evidence of an afterlife.
The Blessed Mother died. Wouldn't you agree her appearances are from the afterlife?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 36 by jar, posted 05-20-2012 8:21 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 41 by jar, posted 05-20-2012 8:29 PM shadow71 has seen this message but not replied
 Message 44 by DrJones*, posted 05-21-2012 12:46 PM shadow71 has seen this message but not replied
 Message 45 by frako, posted 05-21-2012 1:22 PM shadow71 has seen this message but not replied

  
shadow71
Member (Idle past 2963 days)
Posts: 706
From: Joliet, il, USA
Joined: 08-31-2010


Message 47 of 59 (663267)
05-22-2012 7:05 PM
Reply to: Message 25 by Coyote
05-20-2012 5:56 PM


Re: Thanks for the reply, but...
Coyote writes:
OK, if you don't like the terms "shaman" and "slickest con" perhaps we can change it for you to better convey my intended meaning.
How about the promise of an afterlife as made by "religious practitioners" is the most "egregious swindle" ever perpetrated on mankind?
I'm not referring to the actions of a few crooked shamans/priests/etc. but rather the entire concept of religion as put forward by self-appointed religious practitioners, accompanied by unsubstantiated claims of being able to grease the way for their customers into a favorable afterlife--for a price.
Hi Coyote. In message 30 I asked if you beleived Jesus was a Shaman.
Would like an answer, since it is difficult to post in this thead w/o your opinion on this question.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 25 by Coyote, posted 05-20-2012 5:56 PM Coyote has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 48 by Coyote, posted 05-22-2012 7:17 PM shadow71 has not replied

  
shadow71
Member (Idle past 2963 days)
Posts: 706
From: Joliet, il, USA
Joined: 08-31-2010


Message 50 of 59 (663270)
05-22-2012 7:54 PM
Reply to: Message 49 by jar
05-22-2012 7:32 PM


Re: Thanks for the reply, but...
coyote writes:
I'm not referring to the actions of a few crooked shamans/priests/etc. but rather the entire concept of religion as put forward by self-appointed religious practitioners, accompanied by unsubstantiated claims of being able to grease the way for their customers into a favorable afterlife--for a price.
jar writes:
I would say that his followers certainly saw Jesus as a shaman.
You seem to be accepting Coyote's definition above and in your opinion his followers saw Jesus as a Shaman. Can you cite to me some evidence where Jesus was "greasing the way of his followers into a favorable afterlife---for a "price"?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 49 by jar, posted 05-22-2012 7:32 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 51 by Rahvin, posted 05-22-2012 8:08 PM shadow71 has not replied
 Message 52 by jar, posted 05-22-2012 8:10 PM shadow71 has replied

  
shadow71
Member (Idle past 2963 days)
Posts: 706
From: Joliet, il, USA
Joined: 08-31-2010


(1)
Message 53 of 59 (663273)
05-22-2012 8:24 PM
Reply to: Message 52 by jar
05-22-2012 8:10 PM


Re: Thanks for the reply, but...
jar writes:
The first is whether or not Jesus was a Shaman. I don't think that there is any doubt that Jesus was seen as a traditional Shaman, someone with a particular insight and connection to the spirit world, able to oppose demons and evil spirits and to influence good or healing spirits.
But was he doing it for material riches for himself?
jar writes:
The second is the "Are you saved" con. To see that in action all you need to do is listen to Christian radio, watch the televangelists, attend any one of the Christian revivals, gatherings, or festivals, visit almost any Evangelical or Fundamentalist website.
I agree with your 100%. In my opinion all of the televangelists et. al. who promise salvation are con persons.
All of the fundamentalist preachers who judge people and tell their followers they are going to hell are not christians.
Jesus has told us he is the judge. He has told us that we are not to judge our fellow man. that is up to God.
So in my opinion these "preachers" who promise salvation and condemn people are all con men.
I don't believe Jesus was one of those types of "Shamans".

This message is a reply to:
 Message 52 by jar, posted 05-22-2012 8:10 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 54 by jar, posted 05-22-2012 8:48 PM shadow71 has not replied

  
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