|
Register | Sign In |
|
QuickSearch
EvC Forum active members: 65 (9164 total) |
| |
ChatGPT | |
Total: 916,908 Year: 4,165/9,624 Month: 1,036/974 Week: 363/286 Day: 6/13 Hour: 1/2 |
Thread ▼ Details |
|
Thread Info
|
|
|
Author | Topic: Existence | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
1.61803 Member (Idle past 1533 days) Posts: 2928 From: Lone Star State USA Joined: |
If you did not exist you would not be able to ponder existence.
So what can one say about what existence is? Decartes summed it up rather well I think. Congito ergo sum. Reality depends on the physics of our universe to manifest matter and energy into a sentient being capable of pondering self awareness. But the universe could care less what or how or why. Since we are human we can not help but think as a human and inject anthopomorphic reasons de entre. It has long been a phylosophical struggle to relieve existential angst. It takes imo tremendous intellectual bravery to suggest we are a anomaly of no more importance than any other collection of atoms.So my existence is one of my own being giving meaning and importance to my own life and those around me. |
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
1.61803 Member (Idle past 1533 days) Posts: 2928 From: Lone Star State USA Joined: |
ICANT writes: Hmmmm...I thought this universe is a product of the Big Bang. And has it's beginning 14 some billions years ago.
The universe has always existed in some form. ICANT writes: In the past the universe began from the big bang.
The universe has not always existed in its present form.In the past this universe began to exist in the form we see it today. ICANT writes: The materials I assume you mean matter? If so this matter was also a product of the big bang.
In other words the universe as we see it today was assembled from existing materials in the past.ICANT writes:
Heres my understanding of it, I'm sure Cave diver and others will cringe! Now if you have a mechanism whereby matter and energy can begin to exist from an absence of anything (non-existence) I am all ears.The "mechanism" whereby matter and energy began to "exist" is called the big bang. It was not a mechanism though but a quantum event. The matter and energy did not "begin to exist" in sofar as it was a emergent property of the big bang manifesting energy into the physical reality we experience in this universe. It is one theory the fundamental properties of these particles of matter are made up of a plankes size fibers of woven membranes vibrating at specific resonance in 11 dimensions, to give rise to the different manifestations of this energy. There are fundamental forces that are responsible for how this energy and matter are responsible for everything from stars to apples. In our particular universe these physical laws are what allows scientist to unravel these processes. It is not intuitive for us to be able to imagine how this could stem from "nothing". But that is because our concept of "nothing" is incomplete when it comes to quantum levels. There are particles of matter and anti-matter that as you say spring from nothing, exist and annulate each other. There is a theory that the whole universe is like a holograph, discrete and complete bits of information composed from ever smaller bits and yet on every level from the quantum to the cosmic it is all unified. It could very well be as simple as Our current universe exist because it wants to exist. If it did not then that would be the status quo and you would not be here to ponder it.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
1.61803 Member (Idle past 1533 days) Posts: 2928 From: Lone Star State USA Joined: |
ICANT writes: Sure. It is also the current theory that suggest our universe is a product of this Big Bang. Unless you have another theory that refutes this.
Hmmmm...I thought the BBT was supposed to be an explanation of what happened to the universe from T=10-43 to present. ICANT writes: Of course. Those would be two options.
But regardless the matter had to exist eternally or it had to begin to exist. ICANT writes: Until one can accept that on a quantum level things to not exist you will not be able to "fanthom" how existence is perpetual, or how a wave function can manifest reality. The creation of our universe from a quantum fluctiation known as the big bang is the current scientific theory. If a religious person wants to think they're God was responsible then thats fine. If the same person wants to say the universe has always existed thats fine too.
The problem here is that no one can fathom what no thing, non-existence or an absolute absence of anything is. If no thing exists then no thing exists or can exist without beginning to exist. For that a mechanism is required. Can you present such a mechanism?
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
1.61803 Member (Idle past 1533 days) Posts: 2928 From: Lone Star State USA Joined: |
Your level inquiry exceeds my ability to answer. As far as I know the Big bang is the starting point. Prior to the Big bang is unknown.
No one knows the origin of the Big bang. Thats like asking where does the number zero begin? ICANT writes: I do not know. How can you see your own eye? look in a mirror? take a photo? a pool of water? The problem I see with those studies is that the hot little spot in which all in the universe was contained was very, very, very, very hot. I have been told it was trillions of degrees k. So how do you study past that temperature when we can't even reach that temperature?We rely on the tools we have at hand but we can never take ourselves out of the picture because to do that changes the very thing being studied. Ferme Lab and CERN are working on experiments that concern elementary particle physics of high energy states of the early universe. Perhaps you should become a particle physicist and join in the fray? ICANT writes: Perhaps there is no such thing as a state of non-existence. Perhaps there is only a state of probablilties. Who knows? Point of inquiry:If there is non-existence how does a quantum level thing exist? Einstein's cosmological constant was introduced to hold the universe in static equilibrium. I am not aware that it was to show the universe as self existent. Our expanding universe will eventually become so homogenous as to not only be a dead one but a place where even photons are in isolation. It takes 8 minutes for the suns photons to hit your retina. Can you imagine waiting billions of years? Now try to imagine where the number zero begins, or where in the universe is the universe?
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
1.61803 Member (Idle past 1533 days) Posts: 2928 From: Lone Star State USA Joined: |
ICANT writes: So what is it that is existing eternally?
I believe there is eternal existence as I put forth in the OP. ICANT writes: But would you explain how there could be a state of probabilities if there was no existence. If two membranes from two other universes collide and the borrowed energy gives rise to a third universe then that would in theory give rise to a big bang of sorts. A quantum fluctuation. Nothing there and boom a expanding universe.
ICANT writes:
Yes you did. Right here in message 80.
I did not say the cosmological constant was to show the universe as self existent.ICANT message:80 writes: Since Einstein believed the universe had always existed he invented a fudge factor which he said later in life was his biggest blunder. I am finished with our discussion ICANT, you do not remember what you say from one post to the next.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
1.61803 Member (Idle past 1533 days) Posts: 2928 From: Lone Star State USA Joined: |
ICANT writes: Einstein simply believed the universe was eternal, and supported that belief by inventing the cosmological constant. At present there are those who think he may have been correct Dude, you brought up the Einstein thing because it supported your premise of a self existent universe, helloooOOOoo? And then you turn around and say " I did not SAY it, Einstein said it. wtf? And you end with this bit now.
ICANT writes: Which of course alludes to your original premise again of a self existent universe. At least have the balls to take ownership in what your alluding to.
At present there are those who think he may have been correct
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
1.61803 Member (Idle past 1533 days) Posts: 2928 From: Lone Star State USA Joined: |
Rahvin writes: Post of the month!! I can see ICANTS head implode right now.
Yes...to both
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
1.61803 Member (Idle past 1533 days) Posts: 2928 From: Lone Star State USA Joined:
|
How is it possible in this day and age for relativity and special relativity (already experimentally confirmed) be in question? Cant people who doubt these basic tenants of physics read? Is it some nation wide conspiracy??????? I am confounded that something as fundalmental in physics, of which has been universal and accepted as well as the corner stone in modern phyics is being treated as some sort of consipracy. If it where voodoo physics then half the shit in ER and Surgical suits would not work. Most modern telecom devices would be defunked. Every single advance in science since Einstiens papers would not be making contributions in developing scientific devices. Its one thing for some jackass to say,," Well uh,,, I dont get it." But to say..
"Well uh,, I dont get it, because it dont make no sense to me, so it must be wrong." lol...bahhhaawaahhhhhaaa!!lmao!!! Edited by 1.61803, : No reason given.
|
|
|
Do Nothing Button
Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved
Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024