|
Register | Sign In |
|
QuickSearch
EvC Forum active members: 65 (9164 total) |
| |
ChatGPT | |
Total: 916,913 Year: 4,170/9,624 Month: 1,041/974 Week: 0/368 Day: 0/11 Hour: 0/0 |
Thread ▼ Details |
|
Thread Info
|
|
|
Author | Topic: Old Earth Flood Geology | |||||||||||||||||||||||
Randy Member (Idle past 6277 days) Posts: 420 From: Cincinnati OH USA Joined: |
quote: Water vapor can exist outside the atmosphere. In fact water outside the atmosphere even if originally as ice will sublime away but it will not stay in a canopy unless you want to violate the laws of thermodynamics. Water vapor is gas. A gas outside the atmosphere will simply diffuse through space trying to equilibrate with entire universe. No canopy and no flood.
quote:This makes no sense. One thing is clear is that if you had superheated flood waters there would be no life on earth. I have referred to this before as steamed ark soup. quote:We have all seen Walt Brown's blithering nonsense refuted before and many of us are capable of refuting all or most of it ourselves so I don't see why anyone would get uptight about it. It is totally absurd and designed only to appeal to the scientifically ignorant. Edited by Randy, : No reason given.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||
Randy Member (Idle past 6277 days) Posts: 420 From: Cincinnati OH USA Joined: |
quote: The actual concentration of these trapped ions (note they are ions, that is the only reason they can be trapped) is about 40/cc.http://www.agu.org/pubs/crossref/2005/2005GL022653.shtml I calculate that you would need to condense a "Vapor canopy" of this concentration that extends from the surface of the earth out to about half way to the moon to get a kilometer of water from your global flood from this canopy. Also you will note that the water ions are moving very fast, that is they have tremedous kinetic energy, the kinetic energy, the potential energy due to their position above the earth, the ionization energy and heat of vaporization all would have to be released to get this water to fall to the earth as rain. So how is that going to happen without raising atmospheric temperatures well beyond what life could stand. The answer is they couldn't, even if they could somehow be held in place by some sort of magically high magnetic field. There is a reason that ICR gave up on the vapor canopy a long time ago. It just doesn't work.Randy Added in Edit: BTW those ionized water molecules are escaping into space even though they are in the plasma, they are just being replaced by a little bit of outgassing from Enceladus. Edited by Randy, : Added comment
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||
Randy Member (Idle past 6277 days) Posts: 420 From: Cincinnati OH USA Joined: |
quote:The Bible says that high hills and mountains were covered so you need to have some mountains before the flood. Doesn't it also say the ark landing in the mountains of Ararat? Amusingly creationists both claim there were no significant mountains before the flood and then claim that fossils were sorted because animals either ran faster up or lived higher on mountains while thousands of feet of sediment were deposited. quote:Hydroplate theory is bunk. "Lowering by pressure" is not precisely the correct explaination for the bathymetric profile of the ocean. The principle that applies isostacy. Mountains are thrown up by the collision of plates. Trying to do it quickly in the YEC model creates huge energy problems including releasing enough heat to cook the earth to death but it wouldn't matter in you model since your flood water would have already autoclaved the earth. quote:If you look at your link you will see the ions present that indicate water are all positively charged because electrons have been stripped away so they would not be underestimated. quote:These two statements make no sense and show that you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about so please don't tell me that I need to understand the magneteosphere when you clearly don't understand either the magnetosphere or kinetic and potential energy or heat of vaporization. Randy Edited by Randy, : No reason given.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||
Randy Member (Idle past 6277 days) Posts: 420 From: Cincinnati OH USA Joined: |
quote:I would think that someone would have told you by now that the summit of Everest is made up of marine limestone. The fossils, mostly crinoids, are in the rock not on it. quote:So there are mountains being built up under water in the pacific. How is this relevant to the discussion. quote:Some mountains rise due to upthrust from plate tectonics, other form from volcanoes(which may also be caused by tectonic processes). quote:I am not aware of any evidenc that all sea mounts were once above the "wave base" though sea levels have risen about 120 meters since the peak of the last ice age about 18,000 years ago. quote:Hydroplate theory is total bunk. quote:There are possible explanations within plate tectonics but how are they relevant to your nonsense about a vapor canopy trapped by the magnetoshere as ionized water molecules? quote:The heat is "rejected" through black body radiation, rejected is not exactly the right term but the article is a popularization for those with little knowledge of the science involved. We are not talking about super heated molecules that are "rejected abouve" the atmosphere. A vapor canopy in space can't remain coherent because the water molecules, as gases will just diffuse out into space. Even if they didn't and were somehow held in place they would have potential energy relative to the earth and latent heat of vaporization. Both that latent heat of vaporization and that potential energy must be shed as water falls to earth. The potential energy will be converted to kinetic energy under the influence of gravity and then into heat due to friction against the air. Your idea of having them somehow present in the form of a highly energetic ionized plasma just makes those problems worse. Randy
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||
Randy Member (Idle past 6277 days) Posts: 420 From: Cincinnati OH USA Joined: |
Just to let you know Coragyps: Charley has been around before and is being dishonest in using a new id. He will say all sorts of utterly absurd things, he will not listen to a thing you post; you are wasting any time you spend on him. I am noticing that as well. Randy
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||
Randy Member (Idle past 6277 days) Posts: 420 From: Cincinnati OH USA Joined: |
They are not dispersing out into space in Titans magnetosphere. But they are. Read the article again. First they are ionized and trapped by a magnetic field 580 times the strength of earth's. Second they are almost certainly being lost from Saturn's "tail" but are being replenished by interaction with Saturn's moons. The source of the water is outgassing from Enceladus. Randy
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||
Randy Member (Idle past 6277 days) Posts: 420 From: Cincinnati OH USA Joined: |
quote: So you are now trying to claim that the flood water could have come from the moon?! You do realize that anything falling to earth from that far in space will hit the earth with a velocity of at least 11,200 m/s don't you? This means that each meter of global water falling to earth from space will carry kinetic energy equal to about 3 x 10^25 J which will be enough to heat the atmosphere to about 6,000 degrees. I guess that ark had a really good air conditioning system. Randy
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||
Randy Member (Idle past 6277 days) Posts: 420 From: Cincinnati OH USA Joined: |
quote:It's Saturn's magnetosphere not Titan's and 40 ionized water molecules per cc hardly constitutes a water canopy. Further Saturn's magnetic field is about 580 times the strength of earth's. I have not read enough of your posts to know if everything you post is absurd as Ned says but this certainly is and most of the other stuff I have read from you is also absurd. Water from a magetosphere could not provide water for either a YEC or OEC global flood and it has been clearly explained why not. Edited by Randy, : spelling
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||
Randy Member (Idle past 6277 days) Posts: 420 From: Cincinnati OH USA Joined: |
quote:It is true that the OEC global flood avoids many of the geological absurdities of the YEC flood but it still has many problems. In addition to the "where did the water come from and where did it go question", there are big issues of biogeography and biodiversity and the fact that there is no real evidence of this global flood in the world's geology. Most OECs seem to accept a local flood. However, wmscott who used to post here seems to be a global flood OEC. His old thread on the subject is closed but you can browse it HERE I think the water problem is huge for OEC flood models because the source of the water must either be around for the 4.5 billion years of earth history or come from outer space which has huge problems due to kinetic energy considerations. Randy
|
|
|
Do Nothing Button
Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved
Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024