The predictions of Walt Brown

No significant amount of any stuff can be added to the atmosphere in any form at any height without killing everything on Earth other than a few heat-resistant bacteria. The pressure at the Earth's surface would have to be increased by the weight of the stuff divided by the surface area of the Earth, and the temperature would have to be increased by whatever amount is needed to put the stuff in a vapor form. This is basic, high-school science (although the actual calculations probably require some college-levfel thermodynamics training). See the references I gave in Message 145.

Not really ... the reason that most limestone is such a great place to find marine fossils is that most limestone is marine fossils.

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Ned, Ok since you understand magnetics please explain how turtles using magnetics can triangulate a small island in the ocean by magnetics. If magnetics is simply north and south how are they finding east and west

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JM: If I may interject here. THe Earth's magnetic field is not simply a north-south thing. It is a vector composed of declination (the angle between magnetic north and your position), inclination (dip of the magnetic field) and strength. Inclination varies with latitude and also (because the magfield is not symmetric with the geographic north pole) it varies with longitude as does declination and total field strength. Now, I don't know specifically which turtles are using magnetism for migration or if they use ONLY magnetism for their migratio , but unless the islands lie perfectly along isogons or isoclines of declination and inclination, there will be variations in both (as well as field strength).CheersJoe MeertPS: Just did a quick search on some sea turtles. They do, as I guessed, use inclination and field strength as a means for navigation.This message has been edited by Joe Meert, 01-21-2005 09:03 AM

Joe Meert, I find it interesting that you say it varies with longitude, now what would cause that to be the case. North and South appears the magnetic field entering the earth at increasing intensities the closer to true north or south, but having a hard time understanding what that has to do with east west.If it either magnetic reversals or magnetic intensities. It appears to me this controversy has something to do with what your saying. That the east west magnetic declination varies with longitude. That's why I gave you the bible verse that God laid down his compass in the depths, and my belief that its so his creatures could navigate not just north and south, but east and west.

It's because the magnetic poles aren't at the true (spin} poles of the Earth. A compass points due north in Kentucky, but 8 degrees off in Oklahoma at the same latitude.Look up "compass" in your Funk & Wagnalls'. It has more than one meaning, Tom.

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It's because the magnetic poles aren't at the true (spin} poles of the Earth.

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JM: I even mentioned that! Here's a pretty good summary of the topichttp://www.geocities.com/magnetic_declination/#DECLINATIONCheersJoe Meert

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It's because the magnetic poles aren't at the true (spin} poles of the Earth.

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JM: I even mentioned that! Here's a pretty good summary of the topichttp://www.geocities.com/magnetic_declination/#DECLINATIONCheersJoe Meert

How did you manage to double post? That's not supposed to be possible anymore. I'm going to try to double post this.About your link: http://www.geocities.com/magnetic_declination/#DECLINATIONIt says, "But since the Earth's field is the effect of complex convection currents in the magma..."We've been discussing this another thread, Geomagnetism and the rate of Sea-floor Spreading, and the concensus there is that the field is the effect of convection currents in the outer core, which is nickel/iron. It's the mantle that consists of magma, but we haven't found any sources that believe that mantle currents make any contribution to the field. Or is it that the metals in the magma influence the field?--Percy

It seems there is something we missed. Perhaps a forum guideline needs to be added:87.3b "It is necessary to be able to read English, to apply this skill to the posts of others and your own and to be able to garner meaning from this reading even if it is not directly stated in the posts."You still don't know what the "compass" is all about!!!?????

Joe Meert, If the magnetic field enters the earth at different latitudes in respect to the angle of true north/south. Then your magnetic expressions should of captured the east west and north south declinations angles.If the poles actually switched you'd think there would be massive east west differences in respect to north or south. Does the east west declination angle change much if any between reversals?It appears the magnetic north is constantly changing, so then should your east west declination angles captured in rock. If they are not changing then magnetic reversals are nothing but a normal phenomenom (not time related). I'm just not sold they are all time related, some perhaps. Just undecided at this point if they are not just magnetic intensities.The bible in respect to the verse that says compass, another meaning of compass means circuit. Meaning it might be necessary for reversals so to complete the circuit and that it has nothing to do with magnetic north and south flip flopping.I agree though that when the rocks cooled the polarity was captured, but still undecided if it has anything to do with the north/south pole actually switching. Its probably just a normal phenomenom needed so to complete the circuit.If you have a site that explains how you know its a reversal thats not too complicated it would be appreciated. That explains how much the east west angle changed between reversals, and how these polarities prove its not just a magnetic intensity.

You are thinking through what the consequences of a hypothosis would be. Then you come up with something to check out to see if the consequences are there. That is the right way to arrive at conclusions scientifically. Good job.In fact, there are many places where volcanic eruptions have occured and reoccured laying down one layer of lava over another. These record the motion of the poles and other changes in the field over time. This is a tiny part of the support for all of this.Then, sigh, you go back to, well, strange: I would have thought by now Tom that you would have tried to figure out what compass in the Bible actually means instead of making such totally off-the-wall hilarisous comments like the above.Now read this carefully:
It has NOTHING to do with magnetic fields or circuits or anything of the kind. Go back through the thread to where you originally brought up this particular cock-a-maymie idea and find the picture of God useing a "compass" that you were given. K? Until you have done that do not continue piling on examples of just how little you know.

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The bible in respect to the verse that says compass, another meaning of compass means circuit. Meaning it might be necessary for reversals so to complete the circuit and that it has nothing to do with magnetic north and south flip flopping.

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Another use of the word "compass" is the tool used to draw circles. So when the Lord set his compass on the earth He made it into a circle. That's the way I read it. (sorry if I ruined everyone's fun)

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I agree though that when the rocks cooled the polarity was captured, but still undecided if it has anything to do with the north/south pole actually switching. Its probably just a normal phenomenom needed so to complete the circuit.

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Defining "compass" as "circuit" doesn't make a whole lot of sense within the verse, so I don't see how you can apply it here. If one rock records one polarity and another rock records the opposite polarity, doesn't it make sense that the polarity changed between the solidification of each rock?

Sorry? Then why did you do it? There are times when staying quiet is appropriate.

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It says, "But since the Earth's field is the effect of complex convection currents in the magma..."

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JM: oops, I didn't catch that I was looking for another explanation of declination and inclination. In reading that, it appears as if the writer is talking about the mantle and that is incorrect.CheersJoe MeertPS: I have no idea how I double posted!

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If the magnetic field enters the earth at different latitudes in respect to the angle of true north/south. Then your magnetic expressions should of captured the east west and north south declinations angles.

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If the poles actually switched you'd think there would be massive east west differences in respect to north or south. Does the east west declination angle change much if any between reversals?

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JM: Indeed, they do. There is still some disagreement about whether or not there are preferred paths, but high resolution paleomagnetic studies document these swings in declination. I'll try to dig up a figure of it, but you are 100% correct in your deduction.CheersJoe Meert