Did Jesus betray Judas?

This is what I've never understood: why did Yahweh decide to have an ultra strict law that nobody could live up to and then give a get out clause in the first place?Why not relax the laws (or make them more reasonable in the first place) and nobody would have had to betray anyone or get crucified and preople can still get into heaven?I assume that because we are talking about Jesus here, that Yahweh is the current ever loving, forgiveness merchant rather than his older incarnation of a total bloodmunger.Why did Jesus have to die? Why did neoYahweh not just say "look fellas, I know in the past the law was a bit of a fucker, but now I'm seeing things a different way: come on in the gates to heaven are open. No don't worry Jesus, I've decided by fiat that you don't have suffer. Any one for nachos?"

What gets me is that the only way Yahweh could conceive of for letting humanity off was to torture himeself/Jesus (depending on your point of view) to death.Why Yahweh decided that this was the only way to say humanity from himself (i.e. from Yahweh) is beyond me.It's as if Yawah had to torture himself/Jesus to save us from a punishment Yahweh decided to visit us with.Why not just remove the punishment then there would be no need for the torture? Oh well, I imagine you are right and Yahweh is still in bloodmonger mode...

Sin cannot enter Yahwehs's presence because he decides it cannot enter his presence.He also decides what counts as sin: if he were to say "from now on sinning and hell is only for the big stuff! Not for acting in the way I made you. Behaving as you are designed to behave is no longer sin" then the world would be a much better shape.That's what I reckon. Does then the genius parent condemn their child to eternal torment because their son is merely bright?Yahweh sets the standard impossibly high because he chooses to, not because he is compelled to. He sets the rules that we cannot abide by and makes us jump through the hoop of 'accepting Jesus' before he chooses to let us off the hook.Well done Yahweh for being the cause and solution to all of humanities problems.Edited by Larni, : No reason given.

This is where you are wrong.Yahweh could have given them Death without altering the genetic make up. He's a god after all. Unless you are placing arbitrary limits on his power? He did not need to put Judas through all the heart ache of betraying his friend, as a result. Again you place an arbitrary limit on your gods power. He needed to do no such thing. You are making it up: where in the bible does it put limits on Yahweh's power? He could have done it all with out engineering Judas into a situation in which Yahweh knew he would sin! Legally? What are you talking about? On the one hand you say Yahweh had no choice but to condemn all of humanity to death and eternal torment but on the other you say he created a loop whole that would allow him to break the rules. The question I ask is: Why set the rules up in the way he did, why use all these convoluted methods co opting otherwise innocent people (Judas) when he could have avoided the situation by just with the punishment of Adam and Eve (but again, Yahweh set them to to fail, too)?If Yahweh had used a scalpel on the problem of Adam and Eve (which he again instigated) and smote them there and then rather than buggering around with genetic material as you insist, Judas would not have betrayed Jesus and Jesus would not have had to die. Peg, please believe me that I understand that this is the current system: my contention is that it did not need to be the current system if Yahweh had have been a better, wiser father. Yahweh made us imperfect (as discussed above) when he could have punished Adam and Eve rather than all of humanity.Yahweh (in his infinite power) did not need to do that, no one, Jesus or Judas would have had to suffer.Edited by Larni, : Staying on track

Peg, Yahweh did not need to tinker with their genetics to give them death. Peg, if Yahweh had not decided to define sin as 'the act of being human' none of any of this sacrifice and betrayal and engineering a situation where poor Judas would follow the character Yahweh gave him would have been necessary.I repeat, there is no reason for Jesus make his sacrifice apart from Yahweh deciding he had to. If Yahweh had decided that all humanity did not need to suffer, they would not suffer.Yahweh make all the rules and can break any he chooses. He chose to have his son crucified when it was within his omnipotent power to select another less bloodthirsty option. If Yahweh could only admit he made a mistake, none of this suffering would have been required. Rubbish! When Adam died the price was paid. No further torment was required until Yahweh mandated that it was required because that's what he wanted to happen. If Judas' part in this whole mess was not required, why did Jesus say it would have been better he had not been born? This implies his actions were of most high import. If he was merely fulfilling a prophecy it is hardly something he can be blamed for, can it? Peg, for the last time YAHWEH COULD HAVE SUBJECTED ADAM TO DEATH WITHOUT TINKER WITH GENETICS! I'M SORRY TO SHOUT BUT YOU NEVER SEEM TO ACKNOWLEDGE THIS POINT!The rest of your post is intriguing but I fear the wrath of Moose to much to go into it: but I'd be more than happy to discuss it in another thread, if you're interested.

No Peg.Even un-divine me can think of ways to introduce death into an undying sysytem.You could use a slow acting poison, you could even re write then dna of all cell apart from sperm and egg cells. Yahweh (in his infinite power) had a myriad of options.But the one he chose would condemn every human from then on to eternal torment unless they jump through a specific hoop.This is going well off topic so I'm starting another thread.

Better for all not to decide all people should pay for one persons crime.

By using your divine power to remover the imperfection.A snap of YHWH's fingers.