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Author | Topic: The continuation of art styles through a speculated flood | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Cold Foreign Object  Suspended Member (Idle past 3077 days) Posts: 3417 Joined: |
Flood Legends From Around the World
The above link is for easy reference to what I am about to argue. The FACT that there are Flood accounts in diverse worldwide civilizations means a Flood happened. The Bible provides the origin and source and protected version of facts. It is pure nonsense to expect anyone to believe that the multiplicity of worldwide Flood accounts is not based upon a historical event. From South Amercica to the Middle East and across Eurasia and China Flood accounts exist. The existence of these accounts can only be attributed to a Flood occurring.
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Cold Foreign Object  Suspended Member (Idle past 3077 days) Posts: 3417 Joined: |
I have not ignored you or anyone else.
I received a long sought after career advancement and unfortunately I cannot spend all god-damn day on-line. Another debater in one of my topics suddenly is insinuating that delay = paucity of evidence - seems like I cannot get the same benefit I give to everyone of my opponents. I am genuinely surprised that you felt bored enough to condescend your attention to one of my replies since you do usually ignore me. One time some friends of ours owned a house and the lower floors were flooded during a heavy rainstorm. The flooded areas were under water for about a week. After the rains subsided and we cleaned it all up about a month later there was no signs of a flood in their home.
I really want to know your explanation for this, WT. Why would the descendants of a group of eight people pick up the artistic style of a culture they had no connection to? Who said 'they' had no connection to the Greeks ? Greek culture was a simulataneously developing civilization along side of Hebrew. S[h]emite immigration from Egypt into Greece is responsible for the foundational origins of their magnificent culture.[source: "Common Backround of Greek and Hebrew Civilizations" by Professor Cyrus Gordon] All Hebrews are Shemite/Semite thus the origins of Greek culture.
Please explain why a bunch of Jews would pick up a pagan artistic style. All Jews are Hebrews but not all Hebrews are Jews. My current "Genesis 22 - Not a promise given to the Jews" topic proves the above declaration to be a fact.
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Cold Foreign Object  Suspended Member (Idle past 3077 days) Posts: 3417 Joined: |
All those places flood, though. And their flood accounts don't match each other in terms of time, etc. All civilizations around the Middle East do not flood. In 1Kings, Elijah, a man who lived his whole life in the deserts of Palestine prayed for it NOT to rain. Now how silly of a prayer to pray for it not to rain in the desert ? Flood accounts DO NOT match - this is a fact. But they ALL have common denominators. The CLAIM of the Bible is that it contains the protected versions of facts and all the other worldwide flood accounts and their "facts" are not protected by God. The common denominators prove that a Flood occurred.
Why is the only explanation One Big Flood? How can the One Big Flood have happened when so much evidence contradicts it? OK Crashfrog please take a few minutes and list the best evidence against a worldwide deluge. Worldwide Flood accounts is the best evidence for the Flood in my opinion because it cannot be contrived or the product of conspiracy. ToE would generate more credibility if it allowed the Flood/catastrophe, but this will never happen because the origin of the Theory is demons according to the N.T. To allow the Flood is to admit the veracity of the Bible and demons will never allow that. CRASHFROG please do not take offense to my reply. I am in no way saying you are demon possessed or trying to insult you. I am a theist who believes what the Bible says - I am being faithful to what the Bible says about this entire subject as you will be faithful to your worldview frame of reference undoubtedly. Your Chuck E. Cheese analogy seems to benefit my position would you please clarify ? Johnny Carson used to whipser something in the ear of a person in the beginning of a row. Then each person would whisper (hopefully what Johnny said) to the next person until the last person would tell Johnny and the information turned out to be totally different from the original person. Hence, the fact that there are many common denominators in the Flood account is damning to your position. This message has been edited by WILLOWTREE, 09-07-2004 07:58 PM
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Cold Foreign Object  Suspended Member (Idle past 3077 days) Posts: 3417 Joined: |
Willowtree, are there any connections with the Hebrew and Japanese culture mentioned by PaulK in Message 29? I honestly never heard of this connection and I have not had the time to review the links in Paulk's post.
If so, what's your take on why the art styles of the pre flood region were continued by the survivors of the flood? This question hinges on the first question so I must answer the same - I don't know. Paulk creates a post which seems to support a connection, albeit the content is deliberately skeletal of any position. The post is actually a Forum Rule Violation in that it contains bare links accompanied by no explanations or argument.
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Cold Foreign Object  Suspended Member (Idle past 3077 days) Posts: 3417 Joined: |
RAZD:
Would you please be considerate and change your obnoxious avatar ? Your argument concerning the existence of worldwide Flood accounts is senseless. You just assert that the differing facts means the Flood never happened. Then to assert that the accounts testify to a local flood defies common sense and is only offered because worldwide accounts evidence the Flood. Your position says the Genesis Flood never happened but somehow every major worldwide civilization decided to incorporate a local deluge story into their culture. What are the chances of this ? Objective persons easily deduce the worldwide accounts have a origin, that ONE of the accounts is responsible for the official facts. The existence of the worldwide accounts proves the Bible correct: A deluge happened.
This argument is an example of the fallacy of exclusion (see Forbidden): Important evidence which would undermine an inductiveargument is excluded from consideration. The requirement that all relevant information be included is called the "principle of total evidence". You failed to apply the above argument. I am waiting..... WT
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Cold Foreign Object  Suspended Member (Idle past 3077 days) Posts: 3417 Joined: |
To summerize, they uncovered some pretty convincing evidence that a massive flooding event occured in the Black Sea with the high probability that there were significant human populations nearby due to poor environmental conditions in Europe and Fertile Crecent. The flooding would have happened such that the encroachment on land would be approx 1 mile per day! To any non-nomadic civilizations near the original coast of the Black Sea, this would have been a terrible thing, certainly worthy of myth. You post evidence of a catastrophe then contrary to your evidence you brand it a myth. Where is the integrity in this ?
I don't think anyone would argue that floods have happened within human history. Even catastrophic floods Evolutionists sure argue against anything catastrophic.
There are plenty of people who do not disregard the potential historic and geologic evidence for very catastrophic floods. Most people just know that the flood from these accounts was definitly not global. Certainly to the people who experienced it it may have seemed like their whole world was being flooded. IOW, they were dumb ass neanderthals and you are going to tell us what they should have said. IOW, they didn't mean what they said, and you evos somehow "know" this. All you are doing is shouting down the evidence with rhetoric/misuse of logic.
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Cold Foreign Object  Suspended Member (Idle past 3077 days) Posts: 3417 Joined: |
I responded to your post.
If you don't want to debate then just quit and refrain from blaming me.
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Cold Foreign Object  Suspended Member (Idle past 3077 days) Posts: 3417 Joined: |
I have another question for you. Why would any flood survivors pick up any action related to other cultures? This question assumes Greek culture was developed and flourishing. How could this be when Greek culture/civilization did not begin to form until 1100 to 1300 years AFTER the Flood ? This chronology renders the remainder of your post irrelevant.
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Cold Foreign Object  Suspended Member (Idle past 3077 days) Posts: 3417 Joined: |
Jazzns writes: Myth - A traditional, typically ancient story dealing with supernatural beings, ancestors, or heroes that serves as a fundamental type in the worldview of a people, as by explaining aspects of the natural world or delineating the psychology, customs, or ideals of society. So even describing something that actually happened can be a myth. You seem to think that a myth must be totally based on imagination. That is simply not the definition of a myth. It does not matter what definition you stipulate onto the word "myth", its reportive and emotive meaning define it to be understood as something that is not true/never happened. Then when questioned about this convoluted definition and its application to describe evidence which supports a claimed event you simply assert "myth" to mean opposite of what it means. IOW, "myth" means "not true" unless challenged when it suddenly means "could be true". This is called rhetoric/misuse of logic also known as the bullshit that lawyers are trained to master. Jesus said "Let your yea mean yea and your nay mean nay". Straight thinkers cannot be deceived by your nonsense.
Well, we could read what they write and decide that there really was ogres and such but since we do live in an age where we are a little less gullible then that we can use our knowledge that we have gained throughout history to try and decipher what real life elements are represented by the myth. This is basically your reply to my accusation that this generation of evos are objective and every ancient to be defective. Your arrogant attitude which thinks you are the shit of all time and every area of knowledge is filtered and washed of anything which contradicts your narrow naturalist worldview. This is called dogma.
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Cold Foreign Object  Suspended Member (Idle past 3077 days) Posts: 3417 Joined: |
Portmaster:
I do not know the answers to your questions. WT
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Cold Foreign Object  Suspended Member (Idle past 3077 days) Posts: 3417 Joined: |
That doesn't even strain credulity. It's a million light-years from being a tenable conjecture. Good description of those who assert worldwide flood accounts to be a local event in that civilizations history.
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Cold Foreign Object  Suspended Member (Idle past 3077 days) Posts: 3417 Joined: |
The Great Flood: 3145 BC
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Cold Foreign Object  Suspended Member (Idle past 3077 days) Posts: 3417 Joined: |
It is also nice to know that you assume that I am a naturalist. Dosen't seem like a naturalist would sign his posts with "God bless" now would he? IOW, by your logic if a person invokes the name of God then they represent Him.
http://www.nobeliefs.com/Hitler1.htm Hitler's religious beliefs and fanaticism (quotes from Mein Kampf) Hitler wrote: "I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord.." As a boy, Hitler attended to the Catholic church and experienced the anti-Semitic attitude of his culture. In his book, Mein Kampf, Hitler reveals himself as a fanatical believer in God and country. This text presents selected quotes from the infamous anti-Semite himself. My point is that your "God bless" doesn't mean a god damn thing.
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Cold Foreign Object  Suspended Member (Idle past 3077 days) Posts: 3417 Joined: |
What would prevent someone from making up a myth about a global flood This position assumes ancients to be lying or not meaning what they say. Why ?
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Cold Foreign Object  Suspended Member (Idle past 3077 days) Posts: 3417 Joined: |
Why is this pattern repeated all over the world, in the Greek Isles, Japan, China, India, Egypt? Assuming this is true. I honestly do not know. Please answer the question.
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