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Author Topic:   paper against evolution, for intelligent design
MrHambre
Member (Idle past 1423 days)
Posts: 1495
From: Framingham, MA, USA
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 11 of 100 (71994)
12-09-2003 9:55 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by sweetstuff383
12-09-2003 8:28 PM


too smart for capital letters
sweetstuff383 writes:
how would you explain the evolution of an organism such as the eye
That sucker's going to WinAce.
------------------
The dark nursery of evolution is very dark indeed.
Brad McFall

This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by sweetstuff383, posted 12-09-2003 8:28 PM sweetstuff383 has not replied

  
MrHambre
Member (Idle past 1423 days)
Posts: 1495
From: Framingham, MA, USA
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 18 of 100 (72156)
12-10-2003 5:40 PM
Reply to: Message 16 by Matt Tucker
12-10-2003 5:27 PM


Re: A Fallacy
Matt,
I think it's a relevant point that Rei made about irreducible complexity. The assumptions inherent in calling something irreducibly complex are impossible to validate. She could just as easily have said that a motorist on the highway would be thrown against the road surface at high speed if you removed his vehicle, which proves that a motorist and a car constitute an irreducibly complex system.
We can assume that a stone archway is irreducibly complex, since it can't stand with any of its parts removed. However, this ignores the fact that scaffolding was used to construct the arch. In biology you have no excuse for making judgements concerning a structure or function on the assumption that it has to have always existed in its present state.
------------------
The dark nursery of evolution is very dark indeed.
Brad McFall

This message is a reply to:
 Message 16 by Matt Tucker, posted 12-10-2003 5:27 PM Matt Tucker has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 19 by Matt Tucker, posted 12-10-2003 6:03 PM MrHambre has replied

  
MrHambre
Member (Idle past 1423 days)
Posts: 1495
From: Framingham, MA, USA
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 24 of 100 (72205)
12-10-2003 9:33 PM
Reply to: Message 19 by Matt Tucker
12-10-2003 6:03 PM


Re: A Question
Matt,
Read the whole statement, okay? I stated that we can make no judgements concerning biological structures on the assumption that they always existed in exactly the same state. We've pointed out that the human auditory system almost certainly had the function of jaw articulation in our reptilian forebears, and there have been persuasive arguments that the bacterial flagellum once served in a strictly secretory function before being co-opted and refined for motility.
I said I can accept that certain things are 'irreducibly complex,' but that fact says nothing about the way these structures or functions came into being. You assume that the fact that an artifact is so fragile that removing one part renders it useless means it was intelligently designed, but I think the opposite is just as likely.
A decent argument could certainly be made for intelligent design creationism if what we saw in nature all seemed purposeful, well-designed, and economical. How much evidence of waste, jury-rigging and redundant complexity is sufficient cause to abandon the hypothesis of purposeful intelligence seems like an individual choice.
------------------
The dark nursery of evolution is very dark indeed.
Brad McFall

This message is a reply to:
 Message 19 by Matt Tucker, posted 12-10-2003 6:03 PM Matt Tucker has not replied

  
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